NEED HELP!! One Track Won't Move

[dozer]

Well I knew eventually the honeymoon with my ASV 4810 would have to end.
While moving snow tonight (-3) I was just about finished with my last job when the right track quit moving. The Brake is on the left track.
I wiggled and wiggled the controls but to no avail. I drove back for supper and thought I would let it cool down. After supper headed back. Started up. Moved 10 feet and stopped again. Thought OK must be too hot or low on oil. Checked all fluids including planetary oil and its all there. Let it cool for 3 hours and tried again. We can't get it to move a 1/16 of an inch on that side.
The left side will move all day long. The engine bears down when you move the right track lever and the hose stiffens up but it will not move at all. I chipped every bit of ice I could find on it (not much since its parked in a heated shop) and it still does nothing.
My big fear is that the planetary went out which I think is pretty rare so I am hoping someone on here has a better explanation or idea. The sooner the help comes the better. I need this machine running.
thanks,
Lucas

 

[leaddog]

Jack up. Have some one move the levers and you should be able to see if the track flexes where it is hung up. If it's the planatary the track won't flex. It could be the outside bearing on the planatary or one of the bogy rollors. I had my planatary go out. I hadn't had it long and had been told it had just been serviced so I hadn't checked the planitary oil. It just stoped moveing and found that a keeper had come loose letting the shaft move and disingage from the hyd. motor coupling. The seals where gone along with most of the inter bearing. It was FULL of rust, dirt and crud. I thought I had bought the farm. I cleaned it up and not a tooth was chipped or showed wear. Put in new seals, bearings it's like new. I also replaced the cage rollers as they were due. I bought some steel tubing and some UHMW plastic tubing and made them. Saved a bundle. The hardest part was getting the long bolts out but I was able to save them. I have some part no.s if you need them. lrobertson11(AT)verizon,net leaddog

 

[dozer]

Jack up. Have some one move the levers and you should be able to see if the track flexes where it is hung up. If it's the planatary the track won't flex. It could be the outside bearing on the planatary or one of the bogy rollors. I had my planatary go out. I hadn't had it long and had been told it had just been serviced so I hadn't checked the planitary oil. It just stoped moveing and found that a keeper had come loose letting the shaft move and disingage from the hyd. motor coupling. The seals where gone along with most of the inter bearing. It was FULL of rust, dirt and crud. I thought I had bought the farm. I cleaned it up and not a tooth was chipped or showed wear. Put in new seals, bearings it's like new. I also replaced the cage rollers as they were due. I bought some steel tubing and some UHMW plastic tubing and made them. Saved a bundle. The hardest part was getting the long bolts out but I was able to save them. I have some part no.s if you need them. lrobertson11(AT)verizon,net leaddog

We did exactly that. Didn't move a bit. We are removing the track tommorrow and will take the plantetary off to rebuild it. I tried removing it today and broke the factory screw jack, and my Handi-man jack trying to collapse the track
We had the bolts that the service manual required loosened or out taken care of. But it was parked outside all last night in -3 weather and since it had come out of heated shop we figured it must have frozen solid. With the help of a 8000# ROC sky-trak we got it pushed into the shop again so it can hopefully heat up tonight.
Once the planetary is off we will see if the motor is turning although I am pretty sure it will. YEAH I feel like I might buy the farm as well. I hope you are right though. Like I said once I get it apart I will let you know what failed and if its nothing but filthy I will jump for joy and gladly pay for new seals, rollers, bearings.
thanks for the reply.
Dozer

 

[dozer]

We did exactly that. Didn't move a bit. We are removing the track tommorrow and will take the plantetary off to rebuild it. I tried removing it today and broke the factory screw jack, and my Handi-man jack trying to collapse the track
We had the bolts that the service manual required loosened or out taken care of. But it was parked outside all last night in -3 weather and since it had come out of heated shop we figured it must have frozen solid. With the help of a 8000# ROC sky-trak we got it pushed into the shop again so it can hopefully heat up tonight.
Once the planetary is off we will see if the motor is turning although I am pretty sure it will. YEAH I feel like I might buy the farm as well. I hope you are right though. Like I said once I get it apart I will let you know what failed and if its nothing but filthy I will jump for joy and gladly pay for new seals, rollers, bearings.
thanks for the reply.
Dozer

Well we got the track off and the bearing flange removed. Does anybody know how to remove the planetary without removing the frame and motor for it? There are bolts on the back but we can only reach 3 of them without removing the slide. We also tried moving it after the track was off and nada. Not a mm.

So all we need to do now is get the planetary off and take it apart too see what needs to be done. So if anybody has an idea please let me know. Because to take the slide off we need to remove the hydraulic hoses and I would rather not dump 28 gallons of hydraulic fluid if I can prevent it.

thanks,
Dozer

 

[leaddog]

Well we got the track off and the bearing flange removed. Does anybody know how to remove the planetary without removing the frame and motor for it? There are bolts on the back but we can only reach 3 of them without removing the slide. We also tried moving it after the track was off and nada. Not a mm.

So all we need to do now is get the planetary off and take it apart too see what needs to be done. So if anybody has an idea please let me know. Because to take the slide off we need to remove the hydraulic hoses and I would rather not dump 28 gallons of hydraulic fluid if I can prevent it.

thanks,
Dozer

If I remember right you could take out the two bolts holding the hyd motor in and the motor will come out as it is coupled with a sliding coupling. I took my hoses loose and didn't loose the oil but because I had to change the oil I might of drained it before removing the hose. But even then you could remove the hoses and pull them up higher than the tank and it shouldn't thermo syshen. Just be sure and cover them so you don't get ANY dirt as that will take out a motor fast. leaddog

 

[dozer]

If I remember right you could take out the two bolts holding the hyd motor in and the motor will come out as it is coupled with a sliding coupling. I took my hoses loose and didn't loose the oil but because I had to change the oil I might of drained it before removing the hose. But even then you could remove the hoses and pull them up higher than the tank and it shouldn't thermo syshen. Just be sure and cover them so you don't get ANY dirt as that will take out a motor fast. leaddog

OK we got the planetary off today.
It was more work that I was prepared too put into it. But yes we were able to remove the motor by shimmying the planetary slide off to the right and reaching behind with a 12" extension to get the bolts off.
Once that was done I slid the frame off the track frame and unbolted the planetary. I took it to a local machine shop to dissassemble and tell me what is wrong with it. One the upside the motor now turns freely and without issue and the planetary is sitll rock solid.
Lets hope it stays cheap.
Dozer

 

[dozer]

OK we got the planetary off today.
It was more work that I was prepared too put into it. But yes we were able to remove the motor by shimmying the planetary slide off to the right and reaching behind with a 12" extension to get the bolts off.
Once that was done I slid the frame off the track frame and unbolted the planetary. I took it to a local machine shop to dissassemble and tell me what is wrong with it. One the upside the motor now turns freely and without issue and the planetary is sitll rock solid.
Lets hope it stays cheap.
Dozer

Awesome news. Once my machine shop got it apart it is only two bearings. All the sun gear and main rings are fine. Pretty much went from a $2500 fix to a $250 fix. They couldn't figure a reason for failure. Had plenty of oil. Just a little bad luck I suppose.
So while its apart I am sending my hydraulic oil away for anylasis. And ordering new filter the whole way around. I have been putting it off a few hours past due but the heart attack this thing gave me was enough to convince me a few dollars now could save me big bucks down the road.
Thanks for the quick responses and help.
Dozer

 

[Tazza]

Awesome news. Once my machine shop got it apart it is only two bearings. All the sun gear and main rings are fine. Pretty much went from a $2500 fix to a $250 fix. They couldn't figure a reason for failure. Had plenty of oil. Just a little bad luck I suppose.
So while its apart I am sending my hydraulic oil away for anylasis. And ordering new filter the whole way around. I have been putting it off a few hours past due but the heart attack this thing gave me was enough to convince me a few dollars now could save me big bucks down the road.
Thanks for the quick responses and help.
Dozer

Great news its something 'simple'. Always good news when you get out of a massive bill for a repair.

 

[dozer]

Great news its something 'simple'. Always good news when you get out of a massive bill for a repair.

Well if nothing else at least all my snow removal profit didn't have to go "poof". Now I can finish the snowblower coversion.
Dozer

 

[skidsteer.ca]

Well if nothing else at least all my snow removal profit didn't have to go "poof". Now I can finish the snowblower coversion.
Dozer

Hope you documenting this with pictures! We expect a full report!
Ken

 

[dozer]

Hope you documenting this with pictures! We expect a full report!
Ken

Well as you know the snowblower conversion is being updated with pictures.
But I will make sure to take pics as I put the planetary back together and the track back on. The manual mentions nothing going as deep as taking off the planetary.
Will be sure to report as the project should begin tommorrow if all goes well.
Dozer

 

[leaddog]

Well as you know the snowblower conversion is being updated with pictures.
But I will make sure to take pics as I put the planetary back together and the track back on. The manual mentions nothing going as deep as taking off the planetary.
Will be sure to report as the project should begin tommorrow if all goes well.
Dozer

Great news. Sounds like you lucked out like I did.When you look inside one of those boxes You can see how just one tooth comeing loose could wipe out the whole box but they are really tough. Mine had the bearing pieces rolling all over and it still was ok. Good idea on having the oil checked and replacing fillters. The price on my three filters from ASV was cheaper than any other place (big surprise). You'll be back in business soon as it's easier to put back together, just follow the steps on putting the track on as it is a heavy beast and four hands are better than two. leaddog

 

[skidsteer.ca]

Great news. Sounds like you lucked out like I did.When you look inside one of those boxes You can see how just one tooth comeing loose could wipe out the whole box but they are really tough. Mine had the bearing pieces rolling all over and it still was ok. Good idea on having the oil checked and replacing fillters. The price on my three filters from ASV was cheaper than any other place (big surprise). You'll be back in business soon as it's easier to put back together, just follow the steps on putting the track on as it is a heavy beast and four hands are better than two. leaddog

I agree, planetary is a major swear word in skidder (as in log skidder, not skidsteer) terminology. Does this system use one input gear and drive 3 planet gear around it, surounded by a outer ring gear?
If its like the skidder system that center gear, that contacts 3 others is the one that wears out first. if you don't keep a eye on it it will wipe out the other 4 gears.
Things went much smooth after we started pulling those out of our skidders every 500 hours and inspecting them for wear.
There is nothing a sickening as the popping crunching and cracking sound you hear when one of those piles up.
Ken

 

[leaddog]

I agree, planetary is a major swear word in skidder (as in log skidder, not skidsteer) terminology. Does this system use one input gear and drive 3 planet gear around it, surounded by a outer ring gear?
If its like the skidder system that center gear, that contacts 3 others is the one that wears out first. if you don't keep a eye on it it will wipe out the other 4 gears.
Things went much smooth after we started pulling those out of our skidders every 500 hours and inspecting them for wear.
There is nothing a sickening as the popping crunching and cracking sound you hear when one of those piles up.
Ken

Yes that is the type of planetary box but it looks to me the weak spot is the seals. It works in such a dirty enviroment that the seals can't keep the dirt out. Alittle dirt in timken bearings and things go bad. Asv says to replace the oil at 50 hrs or no warrenty and change often. It's quite easy to change the oil and this gives you an idea if the seals are going if you start losing oil. It's really hard to keep these out of the mud and such as that is where they really shine. I built a road on one end of my lake with mine and there wasn't any thing else that would get in where I had to go. Right down through the cattails and mud. I had to dig out and move and place over 600yrds of field stone rangeing up to 3tons and then cover with over 1000yrds of sand. It was a fun project and I bought my 4520 just for that but now that I have it I can't get rid of it as I keep finding things to do with it. I knew when I bought it that they were high maint but they are worth it. leaddog

 

[dozer]

Yes that is the type of planetary box but it looks to me the weak spot is the seals. It works in such a dirty enviroment that the seals can't keep the dirt out. Alittle dirt in timken bearings and things go bad. Asv says to replace the oil at 50 hrs or no warrenty and change often. It's quite easy to change the oil and this gives you an idea if the seals are going if you start losing oil. It's really hard to keep these out of the mud and such as that is where they really shine. I built a road on one end of my lake with mine and there wasn't any thing else that would get in where I had to go. Right down through the cattails and mud. I had to dig out and move and place over 600yrds of field stone rangeing up to 3tons and then cover with over 1000yrds of sand. It was a fun project and I bought my 4520 just for that but now that I have it I can't get rid of it as I keep finding things to do with it. I knew when I bought it that they were high maint but they are worth it. leaddog

A few pics of the project.

 

[leaddog]

A few pics of the project.

glad you got it back together. I've been wondering how it went. Those things are sure hard to work on aren't they. Just keep track on the oil. leaddog

 

[dozer]

glad you got it back together. I've been wondering how it went. Those things are sure hard to work on aren't they. Just keep track on the oil. leaddog

Yeah it was a pain. I bought a porta-power and a sledge hammer so the next side goes smoother. I figure I will take the other one off next spring and have the bearings replaced just to be safe. After finding out what a planetary costs $200 in bearings and seals seems pretty reasonable.
Thanks again for your help leaddog. The Timken numbers were very helpful in speeding things along on this project.
Dozer