bobcatzack
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2022
- Messages
- 122
Good advice here for BobCatZach. I have no experience with the 4 cyl engine on these but used to have lots of garage time with points / condenser systems.I run a lot of old stuff, and my personal experience is, that the ignition system has to be clean and in prime condition. I would first make certain the points and condensor are functioning properly. Because my machine is permanently outside and I am in wet climate for the winter months, I find I have to clean the oxidation off the points annually, and although the condensor is not always a problem, if you are experiencing an ignition issue, it would be wise to replace it.
Checking the timing is simple and just a matter of having someone turning the engine over with a timing light connected.
Another method of setting the rough timing, is to disconnect the battery, connect an ohmmeter to both sides of the points, turn the engine over with a socket wrench on the crankshaft bolt, and notice on the timing mark at the front pulley, when the points open.
BTW: when checking the timing, the engine should only be turned in the normal direction of rotation. This is to prevent any error due to slack in the system.
All this should be done even before switching over to a CD ignition system.
That text I sent in the first posting, was taken from an actual listing on ebay.
Bob
Thank you for the wise outlook and advice. Do want to mention that the plug wires were removed, and being a complete novice, I replaced them with new wires and new plugs and had no idea what order to put the wires back on .. they could very well be in a different order! Will that cause the engine to not start?Good advice here for BobCatZach. I have no experience with the 4 cyl engine on these but used to have lots of garage time with points / condenser systems.
Where the CD system may be an upgrade, I think the focus should be a running machine before swapping parts out.
So - old style points -
Does this engine have adjustable points? So far, I have not seen anyone mention Dwell (dwell angle).
Ignition system needs to have good plugs, points, condenser, cap, rotor and wires. Is there a possibility, after the engine got wet / cleaned, that the cap was removed and the carbon stud that contacts the rotor was lost / damaged. I'm thinking not, as upthread there was mention of spark.
No mention of spark quality - yellow - coil is not getting what he wants to fire hot - bad condenser, bad coil. White / blue - good and hot. Let's move on.
Will it run on ether or brake clean? just s squirt to see if the engine even tries.
Zack mentioned timing, but that, IMO, isn't a player here as it was running before the engine cleaning - Unless the water moved the distributor and affected timing that way.
Cap / rotor / wires - did the plug wires get removed and maybe back on in a different order?
What is a big unknown is the rusty wire upthread near the solenoid that goes nowhere. Thinking this is the real issue.
Don't get me wrong guys - I'm all for the CD unit, but I avoid throwing parts at a problem. Would rather spend a few hours verifying the basics instead of a few hundred on 'might be' ideas.
@RandyL thanks! I did buy compression testing kit and found 110 lb and 95 lb on the first two plug points. Perhaps should check them all.My situation was that my 632 would start at times, and seem to run well. Other times it was difficult to start, but when started it would still run well. Finally it got to where it would start no more, just crank over. All the ignition checks were made as mentioned above. Finally I did a compression test, It was extremely low. It should not have ever started at all..down in the 40 pound range. I oiled the cylinders and it was still very low. I decided to pull the motor and find the problem. The major problem was that the rings were totally worn out. Oiling the cylinders did not raise the compression because the pistons have a deep recessed top and all the oil was collected in this dished out area. The dished out pistons messed with my diagnosis of a "wet" compression test. Starts nicely now that it has compression. I still run the standard ignition system. View attachment 2568
Great picture of the 632 engine! I do see your distributor cap is black (my Bobcat 632 has a brown cap). Hoping that the plug wire order would be the same - can you please tell me which wire goes to which cylinder from your distributor? I think I messed up my order when I replaced the plugs and wires. Thanks!!My situation was that my 632 would start at times, and seem to run well. Other times it was difficult to start, but when started it would still run well. Finally it got to where it would start no more, just crank over. All the ignition checks were made as mentioned above. Finally I did a compression test, It was extremely low. It should not have ever started at all..down in the 40 pound range. I oiled the cylinders and it was still very low. I decided to pull the motor and find the problem. The major problem was that the rings were totally worn out. Oiling the cylinders did not raise the compression because the pistons have a deep recessed top and all the oil was collected in this dished out area. The dished out pistons messed with my diagnosis of a "wet" compression test. Starts nicely now that it has compression. I still run the standard ignition system. View attachment 2568
Yes, if your plug wires are wrong the engine will not run. The pistons have a firing order.Thank you for the wise outlook and advice. Do want to mention that the plug wires were removed, and being a complete novice, I replaced them with new wires and new plugs and had no idea what order to put the wires back on .. they could very well be in a different order! Will that cause the engine to not start?
Randy - I am the only one working on my Bobcat 632 (with no 2nd helper) - want to crank while I am on the engine side, as opposed to walking to the front of the bobcat when I am unable to see any dials or readings) - Any suggestions on what part to buy and the wiring needed so I can temporarily crank while working on the engine? Many thanks!My situation was that my 632 would start at times, and seem to run well. Other times it was difficult to start, but when started it would still run well. Finally it got to where it would start no more, just crank over. All the ignition checks were made as mentioned above. Finally I did a compression test, It was extremely low. It should not have ever started at all..down in the 40 pound range. I oiled the cylinders and it was still very low. I decided to pull the motor and find the problem. The major problem was that the rings were totally worn out. Oiling the cylinders did not raise the compression because the pistons have a deep recessed top and all the oil was collected in this dished out area. The dished out pistons messed with my diagnosis of a "wet" compression test. Starts nicely now that it has compression. I still run the standard ignition system. View attachment 2568
I used to bridge the starter but the sparks produced were not fun, not to mention the damage that was happening to the studs.Randy - I am the only one working on my Bobcat 632 (with no 2nd helper) - want to crank while I am on the engine side, as opposed to walking to the front of the bobcat when I am unable to see any dials or readings) - Any suggestions on what part to buy and the wiring needed so I can temporarily crank while working on the engine? Many thanks!
hoping this is the solution for BobCatZack!OK.... lets see if we can get your plugs wires on correctly. This is an old picture from a previous post that shows it pretty good. This is the Ford 1.6 engine. Mine is wired like this. The cap color does not matter. That is the material it is made of.
#1 cylinder is close to you when you open the engine hatch, #4 cylinder is much harder to reach, deep in the engine compartment.
There are 2 clips that hold the dist cap on. They are pictured in the drawing. Use them as a guide for installing the plug wires. The clip closer to the engine block should have wires 1 and 2 on either side of it. wires 4 and 3 are on either side of the other clip. Match these wires to the cylinders of the same number.
The word counterclockwise refers to the direction the rotor turns when the engine is turning over or running. See how clear all of this is.View attachment 2581
hoping this is the solution for BobCatZack!
Basics first.
Still curious about that wire to nowhere that he sees.
Indeed it is very clear - and the way you explained also makes it absolutely clear. Thank you!!OK.... lets see if we can get your plugs wires on correctly. This is an old picture from a previous post that shows it pretty good. This is the Ford 1.6 engine. Mine is wired like this. The cap color does not matter. That is the material it is made of.
#1 cylinder is close to you when you open the engine hatch, #4 cylinder is much harder to reach, deep in the engine compartment.
There are 2 clips that hold the dist cap on. They are pictured in the drawing. Use them as a guide for installing the plug wires. The clip closer to the engine block should have wires 1 and 2 on either side of it. wires 4 and 3 are on either side of the other clip. Match these wires to the cylinders of the same number.
The word counterclockwise refers to the direction the rotor turns when the engine is turning over or running. See how clear all of this is.View attachment 2581