Bought an M-610 Just Need a Little Help

[Kellen]

I never removed any of the races. I didnt see any need for that as they were not damaged.
Its not clear if you have the outer bearing off or not. If you just have one bearing to remove maybe you could just take it to a local mechanic who has a press. Its a one minute job if you already have that bearing puller collar attached.
I was doing all 4 axles so I bought a cheap old screw press. And I love it.
The axle/outer seals/outer bearing/outer hub assembly needs to be done before its inserted back into the frame. The book shows the bearing being reinstalled with a mallet and a piece of pipe. I dont really like that idea but I guess its do-able.
I had no engine in mine so I had plenty of room. I guess to reinstall the inner race you will need to need to remove the inner hub then reinstall it after fitting the race. The inner bearing will just go on with the pressure of the castle nut.
.

I must not have been engaging my brain last night or I would have just figured out I could remove the inner hub. I work on a lot of bikes so replacing the bearing and races at the same time is habit I think. Installing them is never a problem as long as I have easy access. Pulling the bub will do the trick! I might just buy a used Harbor Freight press today since they're cheap and they work. Will make my life easier for the future as well.
On another topic, are folks transitioning to another forum for skid steer related info? This site has a lot of good info, but man is it outdated. It's been a long time since I've used a forum that was this slow or difficult to use just to make a post.

 

[alchemysa]

I must not have been engaging my brain last night or I would have just figured out I could remove the inner hub. I work on a lot of bikes so replacing the bearing and races at the same time is habit I think. Installing them is never a problem as long as I have easy access. Pulling the bub will do the trick! I might just buy a used Harbor Freight press today since they're cheap and they work. Will make my life easier for the future as well.
On another topic, are folks transitioning to another forum for skid steer related info? This site has a lot of good info, but man is it outdated. It's been a long time since I've used a forum that was this slow or difficult to use just to make a post.

(Kellen)... "On another topic, are folks transitioning to another forum for skid steer related info? This site has a lot of good info, but man is it outdated. It's been a long time since I've used a forum that was this slow or difficult to use just to make a post."
Mate, do you see that brick wall over there...
.
In the meantime.. (In case you hadn't seen this suggestion before) ....I find it easier and safer to compose long posts, with html picture links, as a draft in my email program. Then just copy and paste it into the message box.
By the way, 6brnorma started an 'M610 parts' thread under the Bobcat General Questions heading. You might have some comments to add.

 

[Kellen]

(Kellen)... "On another topic, are folks transitioning to another forum for skid steer related info? This site has a lot of good info, but man is it outdated. It's been a long time since I've used a forum that was this slow or difficult to use just to make a post."
Mate, do you see that brick wall over there...
.
In the meantime.. (In case you hadn't seen this suggestion before) ....I find it easier and safer to compose long posts, with html picture links, as a draft in my email program. Then just copy and paste it into the message box.
By the way, 6brnorma started an 'M610 parts' thread under the Bobcat General Questions heading. You might have some comments to add.

Well I'm not exactly sure what the brick wall comment is supposed to mean but I do know that getting visitors and members to a website has much to do with usability. The easier to navigate and use, the more likely they will stay or come back. Oh well. I'm going to keep posting as I repair and learn about my machine. Even if I get stonewalled which is what I think you meant by your comment, hopefully some other guy like me working on one of these machines will be able to use some of what I've learned.
Once my dealer get the parts in, I go over and post prices in 6brnorma thread.

 

[6brnorma]

Well I'm not exactly sure what the brick wall comment is supposed to mean but I do know that getting visitors and members to a website has much to do with usability. The easier to navigate and use, the more likely they will stay or come back. Oh well. I'm going to keep posting as I repair and learn about my machine. Even if I get stonewalled which is what I think you meant by your comment, hopefully some other guy like me working on one of these machines will be able to use some of what I've learned.
Once my dealer get the parts in, I go over and post prices in 6brnorma thread.

Kellen…I have pushed for an upgrade for years and even donated to the fund. I understand your frustration. I have searched many times for better sites but only find "sub-forums" for skid steers on other sites such as Tractors.net, HeavyEquipment sites etc. They have virtually no activity on them…..sometimes years between posts on any 600 series bobcat. It is what it is.

 

[Kellen]

Kellen…I have pushed for an upgrade for years and even donated to the fund. I understand your frustration. I have searched many times for better sites but only find "sub-forums" for skid steers on other sites such as Tractors.net, HeavyEquipment sites etc. They have virtually no activity on them…..sometimes years between posts on any 600 series bobcat. It is what it is.

I think information wise, this site is the best. Like you said, it's the only skid steer specific site out there. I hope that whoever owns the site doesn't give up on it. Might be time for another money raising campaign. I've been on other sites where they show how much they need and the progress towards that goal as money rolls in.
Back on my skid steer last night I started work on the rear axle. It had a brass speedly sleeve on it that would not come off any way that I attacked it. I ended up scoring the metal underneath pretty bad with the chisel so I ended up chucking the axle onto the lathe, removing some material making another sleeve to slip over it and then putting the speedy sleeve over that. I think it's going to work. I guess time will tell.
The next step is to install my new levers. I will be making a video tutorial of this process to hopefully help some other newbies save some time in the future.

 

[alchemysa]

I think information wise, this site is the best. Like you said, it's the only skid steer specific site out there. I hope that whoever owns the site doesn't give up on it. Might be time for another money raising campaign. I've been on other sites where they show how much they need and the progress towards that goal as money rolls in.
Back on my skid steer last night I started work on the rear axle. It had a brass speedly sleeve on it that would not come off any way that I attacked it. I ended up scoring the metal underneath pretty bad with the chisel so I ended up chucking the axle onto the lathe, removing some material making another sleeve to slip over it and then putting the speedy sleeve over that. I think it's going to work. I guess time will tell.
The next step is to install my new levers. I will be making a video tutorial of this process to hopefully help some other newbies save some time in the future.

I don't think the site owner has posted for a year and a half. Thats not really promising. A new forum on another platform could be commenced tomorrow, but theres so much info already on this site it would be tragedy to lose it.
I don't know why a few simple bugs can't be sorted out. It looks like the code is still being maintained...
http://www.dnnsoftware.com/wiki/forum-module
Good work on the sleeve. You must have a good size lathe. If you ever need to do something similar, 2 inch stainless steel 'handrail' tube is the exact same size as the axle. It makes perfect sleeves. I had a thread on this.

 

[Kellen]

I don't think the site owner has posted for a year and a half. Thats not really promising. A new forum on another platform could be commenced tomorrow, but theres so much info already on this site it would be tragedy to lose it.
I don't know why a few simple bugs can't be sorted out. It looks like the code is still being maintained...
http://www.dnnsoftware.com/wiki/forum-module
Good work on the sleeve. You must have a good size lathe. If you ever need to do something similar, 2 inch stainless steel 'handrail' tube is the exact same size as the axle. It makes perfect sleeves. I had a thread on this.

I got the right lever installed tonight. Installation was easy of course but I still can't get the lever to sit straight up and down.
Moving on to the left side, I removed the viewing panel to find two bolts that had previously snapped and had been very poorly repaired. They came right off again. I used a 3/8" end mill to set some holes for the new bolts to sit in then welded them up. I replaced the lever and shaft and same issue with the right side, I can't get the lever to sit straight up and down.
Sitting there scratching me head I realized that the clutch actuator spring is the problem. Don't know if it's stock or not but it doesn't seem to have enough resistance to hold the levers straight. I figure that's the problem with the other side as well. Off to the hardware store as soon as I can to see if I can find slightly shorter springs to replace them with.
If I can get this done, I think I can button it up and see how she's operating.

 

[6brnorma]

I got the right lever installed tonight. Installation was easy of course but I still can't get the lever to sit straight up and down.
Moving on to the left side, I removed the viewing panel to find two bolts that had previously snapped and had been very poorly repaired. They came right off again. I used a 3/8" end mill to set some holes for the new bolts to sit in then welded them up. I replaced the lever and shaft and same issue with the right side, I can't get the lever to sit straight up and down.
Sitting there scratching me head I realized that the clutch actuator spring is the problem. Don't know if it's stock or not but it doesn't seem to have enough resistance to hold the levers straight. I figure that's the problem with the other side as well. Off to the hardware store as soon as I can to see if I can find slightly shorter springs to replace them with.
If I can get this done, I think I can button it up and see how she's operating.

Kellen……do yourself a favor and buy the stock springs…..they're cheap and I have never seen them for sale any place else. Also……if one breaks, you are going to regret that decision.

 

[Kellen]

Kellen……do yourself a favor and buy the stock springs…..they're cheap and I have never seen them for sale any place else. Also……if one breaks, you are going to regret that decision.

I agree about buying OEM stuff, however the spring does not appear to be stretched. Maybe it's lost some tension but if I position it in the machine, straight up and down, the top hook part of the spring isn't under any tension. It's just sitting slightly about the eye that it hooks to on the clutch actuator.

 

[6brnorma]

I agree about buying OEM stuff, however the spring does not appear to be stretched. Maybe it's lost some tension but if I position it in the machine, straight up and down, the top hook part of the spring isn't under any tension. It's just sitting slightly about the eye that it hooks to on the clutch actuator.

Should be under quite a bit of tension………maybe the ones you have are not OEM?? I've never seen it but……could be wear in the linkage also.

 

[Kellen]

Should be under quite a bit of tension………maybe the ones you have are not OEM?? I've never seen it but……could be wear in the linkage also.

Looking at the spring again, I think that the last person in there really cranked down the bottom nut that holds the spring on and stretched out the eye portion of it. I'll call the dealer tomorrow so I can wait another week and a half for a couple springs.

 

[alchemysa]

Looking at the spring again, I think that the last person in there really cranked down the bottom nut that holds the spring on and stretched out the eye portion of it. I'll call the dealer tomorrow so I can wait another week and a half for a couple springs.

I stand to be corrected but I dont think the spring is really meant to hold the lever vertical. Its main purpose is to return the levers to a central position where it will be under almost no tension anyway. If the levers are really determined not stand up straight then you may have to adjust the clutch actuating nuts as per the service manual. A painful job.

 

[Kellen]

I stand to be corrected but I dont think the spring is really meant to hold the lever vertical. Its main purpose is to return the levers to a central position where it will be under almost no tension anyway. If the levers are really determined not stand up straight then you may have to adjust the clutch actuating nuts as per the service manual. A painful job.

It's a little hard to explain so I made a visual. In the process of really tightening down that nut that keeps the spring on, they cranked it so hard that it not only grabbed the spring and stretched it, but the whole bottom of it turned with the nut to the right thus pulling the actuator backwards and putting the lever in the forward position.
The first picture is how the spring is made to fit. Straight up and down. The lever sits in the neutral position and and it returned to neutral by the spring.
The second picture shows how mine was. The springs is twisted clockwise and pull the mechanism backward, pushing the lever forward. The problem is reversed on the other side and as the spring is turned, it pushes the lever to the rear.

 

[6brnorma]

It's a little hard to explain so I made a visual. In the process of really tightening down that nut that keeps the spring on, they cranked it so hard that it not only grabbed the spring and stretched it, but the whole bottom of it turned with the nut to the right thus pulling the actuator backwards and putting the lever in the forward position.
The first picture is how the spring is made to fit. Straight up and down. The lever sits in the neutral position and and it returned to neutral by the spring.
The second picture shows how mine was. The springs is twisted clockwise and pull the mechanism backward, pushing the lever forward. The problem is reversed on the other side and as the spring is turned, it pushes the lever to the rear.

Too bad……no need for that since the nut should be a locking nut in the first place.
If you are going to do a complete adjustment you'll need four of the lead washers for the shafts also. Order them with the springs.

 

[Kellen]

Too bad……no need for that since the nut should be a locking nut in the first place.
If you are going to do a complete adjustment you'll need four of the lead washers for the shafts also. Order them with the springs.

Called a dealer in WI today and found the springs in stock for $6 each. Compare that to my local dealer who wants over $12 each. He would have to order them in and the cheapest shipping he could offer would be $20!. No thanks. I got them for $12 total and $4 shipping. Wish my dealer didn't know he's the only dealer in Idaho.
I also went and picked up my backhoe attachment today. See the pics below. Overall it's in pretty good shape. The cylinders and valves look good. The PO put on new hoses (mostly). I think I'm going to pull it apart and sand and paint it. I will allow me to reassemble and replace items as I go through them.

 

[Kellen]

Called a dealer in WI today and found the springs in stock for $6 each. Compare that to my local dealer who wants over $12 each. He would have to order them in and the cheapest shipping he could offer would be $20!. No thanks. I got them for $12 total and $4 shipping. Wish my dealer didn't know he's the only dealer in Idaho.
I also went and picked up my backhoe attachment today. See the pics below. Overall it's in pretty good shape. The cylinders and valves look good. The PO put on new hoses (mostly). I think I'm going to pull it apart and sand and paint it. I will allow me to reassemble and replace items as I go through them.

So I got it all together today. The engine and hydro is running well. It seems to go forward and reverse much much better but it still doesn't want to turn very well. Looking down when I'm trying to turn, I can see that the belt is slipping or stopped completely. Not sure what causes that. Guess I'm gonna have to hit the troubleshooting page of the manual.
My leak over the belt is still present. I tried to take a picture. Before this start I had hit it with a pressure washer in an attempt to better see where the leak is. You can see that the bottom of the variable speed valve has oil all over it bit I couldn't see any drips. There are two drips hanging off the hydro line that goes to the left rear clutch shaft. Not sure if that's where the leak is or not.
I guess the best course of action would be to remove the variable speed and see about replacing the O-rings and while I'm at it, I should somehow repair that line to the shaft.

I did manage to get it moving around enough to go put the bucket in a better place and pick up the forks. My wife is pretty happy that fork attachment isn't sitting in the driveway anymore.

 

[Kellen]

So I got it all together today. The engine and hydro is running well. It seems to go forward and reverse much much better but it still doesn't want to turn very well. Looking down when I'm trying to turn, I can see that the belt is slipping or stopped completely. Not sure what causes that. Guess I'm gonna have to hit the troubleshooting page of the manual.
My leak over the belt is still present. I tried to take a picture. Before this start I had hit it with a pressure washer in an attempt to better see where the leak is. You can see that the bottom of the variable speed valve has oil all over it bit I couldn't see any drips. There are two drips hanging off the hydro line that goes to the left rear clutch shaft. Not sure if that's where the leak is or not.
I guess the best course of action would be to remove the variable speed and see about replacing the O-rings and while I'm at it, I should somehow repair that line to the shaft.

I did manage to get it moving around enough to go put the bucket in a better place and pick up the forks. My wife is pretty happy that fork attachment isn't sitting in the driveway anymore.

I went ahead and tightened the hydro line going to the rear left clutch. I hope that's where the leak is. I hit it again with degreaser and ran it around. It's still getting a lot of splatter on it so It's hard to tell if there's actually a leak anymore.
Going through a checklist of problems that could cause my drive issue, the only thing that makes sense at this point is the drive belt. I think it's had a leak for a while and then sat for a year with a ton of oil on the belt. If I had to guess, I think the thing is just greasy and glazed over. I hit it with degreaser and brake parts cleaner as best I could. Does a little better but still slipping a lot. I kind of wish it didn't have a variable drive so a belt with teeth could be used. I know that I need to pull the belt and really examine it. I doubt there's much I can do to salvage it so I think I should just order a new belt.
In other news, I ordered seal kits for the lift and tilt cylinders. 2 of them have small leaks but I figured I keep the extra on hand for when I need them.

 

[6brnorma]

I went ahead and tightened the hydro line going to the rear left clutch. I hope that's where the leak is. I hit it again with degreaser and ran it around. It's still getting a lot of splatter on it so It's hard to tell if there's actually a leak anymore.
Going through a checklist of problems that could cause my drive issue, the only thing that makes sense at this point is the drive belt. I think it's had a leak for a while and then sat for a year with a ton of oil on the belt. If I had to guess, I think the thing is just greasy and glazed over. I hit it with degreaser and brake parts cleaner as best I could. Does a little better but still slipping a lot. I kind of wish it didn't have a variable drive so a belt with teeth could be used. I know that I need to pull the belt and really examine it. I doubt there's much I can do to salvage it so I think I should just order a new belt.
In other news, I ordered seal kits for the lift and tilt cylinders. 2 of them have small leaks but I figured I keep the extra on hand for when I need them.

Your problem is oil on the belt…….don't replace it until you locate the source.
When you actuate the variable speed sheave…….does it hold in high?

 

[alchemysa]

Your problem is oil on the belt…….don't replace it until you locate the source.
When you actuate the variable speed sheave…….does it hold in high?

How did you go with the levers? With the springs fitted did the lever sit vertically, with about 4" movement in each direction?

 

[Kellen]

How did you go with the levers? With the springs fitted did the lever sit vertically, with about 4" movement in each direction?

As far as the lever go, they will sit at vertical now. I adjusted them so they have about 3.5" of movement each way. I also checked the actuator nuts to make sure they have full contact when put in forward or reverse. They don't always want to return to neutral but unlike before, when I put it in neutral, it will stay there.
I'll check again today, but I believe the variable speed sheave does stay in high when I put it there. I was just out of town for 3 days and when I returned, there was nothing leaking. I think that's a good sign. Really hoping it was just that clutch shaft hydro fitting that needed to be tightened.
I need to pull the drive belt. Was hoping that I could check it for cracks and wear and possible lightly sand the edges if it looked good. The procedure doesn't seem that hard to do but the service manual makes everything seem simple. I think I want to remove the cage though. Don't know if that's a good idea or not but as access to the mechanical stuff is hard already, I hope that will ease the pain a little.