Lx 465 Steering Issue After Service.

[Finman]

I just took my Lx 465 to a New Holland dealer for a small leak in a hydro hose, and told them to just go over everything and check everything you can so I know I'm good to go, and just got it back yesterday. Now the thing steers horribly!!! It very difficult to make the thing go straight forward or backwards without it jerking either right or left. It's very very jerky and jumpy and now it feels like the right stick needs much more movement to it for anything, and the left stick seems overly sensitive. Heck I even smacked the jamb of my garage door opening with the side of the bucket putting it back in my garage. The mechanic told me he had it up off the ground and set both side pumps to neutral, but I'm just not too sure he adjusted it correctly because it steered a heck of lot better before this was done. How can you not set them correctly??!!!? Is it possible to not set them correctly?? I'm very mechanically inclined, but I'm not a certified New Holland mechanic or anything, and at this point I'm not sure the mechanic that worked on it is either, but this just doesn't seem right at all. I'm going to call them tomorrow and tell them I'm very unhappy with the way it steers now, but now I'm afraid they're going to screw it up even more if they tell me to take it back to them. What the heck should I do here? Screw them, and try to adjust both sides myself or what? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!! Thanks!! Fin

 

[Tazza]

I would talk to them first.
The on;y reason they would re-adjust the steering is the stops wear over time and you would have found the machine would creep. Thats what they will have adjusted, its the neutral. This shouldn't have made it any more sensitive....
You paid for the service, give them a call and see what they say. I wouldn't fiddle with it i'd let them do it, that way they can't say its your fault as you changed something.

 

[Finman]

I would talk to them first.
The on;y reason they would re-adjust the steering is the stops wear over time and you would have found the machine would creep. Thats what they will have adjusted, its the neutral. This shouldn't have made it any more sensitive....
You paid for the service, give them a call and see what they say. I wouldn't fiddle with it i'd let them do it, that way they can't say its your fault as you changed something.

Yeah, I realize that's why they would have adjusted it, but what the mechanic did was notice that it pulled to the one side a little at low RPM. Well he couldn't figure out why so he made a call to New Holland and they told him that the Lx 465 must be run and operated at high RPM for the pumps to reach optimum pressure. He said they told him to run it and adjust it at 1750 RPM, when in my manual it states to run it at 2900 RPM or higher for optimum pressure, which does even seem a little high to me. I usually operate the machine at about 2500 RPM. But I do agree with you, and after paying for the service, I'll call them and see what they have to say before I decide to try it myself. ps. Why the heck do none of my paragraphs separate...? It all just runs into one big paragraph when I preview and post what I typed... Pretty annoying... What the heck???

 

[Finman]

Yeah, I realize that's why they would have adjusted it, but what the mechanic did was notice that it pulled to the one side a little at low RPM. Well he couldn't figure out why so he made a call to New Holland and they told him that the Lx 465 must be run and operated at high RPM for the pumps to reach optimum pressure. He said they told him to run it and adjust it at 1750 RPM, when in my manual it states to run it at 2900 RPM or higher for optimum pressure, which does even seem a little high to me. I usually operate the machine at about 2500 RPM. But I do agree with you, and after paying for the service, I'll call them and see what they have to say before I decide to try it myself. ps. Why the heck do none of my paragraphs separate...? It all just runs into one big paragraph when I preview and post what I typed... Pretty annoying... What the heck???

Never mind about the paragraph thing...
I didn't know that the html editor thing had to be enabled in your profile and wasn't by enabled by default...oops...
Thanks...

 

[mllud]

Never mind about the paragraph thing...
I didn't know that the html editor thing had to be enabled in your profile and wasn't by enabled by default...oops...
Thanks...

The only thing you could do to check their work is jack it up and get all four tires off the ground. The wheels should not turn with it running with your hands off the sticks. I just adjusted the steering on my lx865 and it doesnt act erratic at low R.P.M.s.
I would have them look at it and be there when they drive it.If The mechanic had to call New Holland I would be concerned. Does it creep? Watch them. Mike

 

[Finman]

The only thing you could do to check their work is jack it up and get all four tires off the ground. The wheels should not turn with it running with your hands off the sticks. I just adjusted the steering on my lx865 and it doesnt act erratic at low R.P.M.s.
I would have them look at it and be there when they drive it.If The mechanic had to call New Holland I would be concerned. Does it creep? Watch them. Mike

No, it doesn't really creep at all, but there is a real fine line on the sticks being in the neutral position. The left stick is real touchy and when it's in neutral, it sure doesn't take much movement on that left stick to move the machine!! But the right stick isn't real touchy like the left one is.
Another thing is that it is real difficult to get it to go straight on from a dead stop in neutral now, and it wasn't like that before I gave it to them. It seems like I have to move the right stick so much more and be ever so delicate with the left stick and feather it. If I don't feather it, it jerks. The whole situation's got me a little ticked off since I didn't have these issues until they got their hands on it...
Yeah I was a bit concerned too when he said he had to call New Holland... Ugh...
Thanks for the opinions so far!! Any other suggestions or opinions from anybody else are appreciated!!

 

[mllud]

No, it doesn't really creep at all, but there is a real fine line on the sticks being in the neutral position. The left stick is real touchy and when it's in neutral, it sure doesn't take much movement on that left stick to move the machine!! But the right stick isn't real touchy like the left one is.
Another thing is that it is real difficult to get it to go straight on from a dead stop in neutral now, and it wasn't like that before I gave it to them. It seems like I have to move the right stick so much more and be ever so delicate with the left stick and feather it. If I don't feather it, it jerks. The whole situation's got me a little ticked off since I didn't have these issues until they got their hands on it...
Yeah I was a bit concerned too when he said he had to call New Holland... Ugh...
Thanks for the opinions so far!! Any other suggestions or opinions from anybody else are appreciated!!

The linkages going to the pumps go to a bell crank. If they have those linkages adjusted unequally in lenght, from one side to the other,it wouldnt take much to make the drive handles move a different amount to get the same action.There is a procedure for doing this.Hope that made sence. I think he didnt read the manual.
The two shock absorbers that center the drive stick could be out of balance from one side to the other making one harder to push one than the other. that would make it harder for you to drive. There is a prodceeure for this in the operators manual. Mike

 

[Finman]

The linkages going to the pumps go to a bell crank. If they have those linkages adjusted unequally in lenght, from one side to the other,it wouldnt take much to make the drive handles move a different amount to get the same action.There is a procedure for doing this.Hope that made sence. I think he didnt read the manual.
The two shock absorbers that center the drive stick could be out of balance from one side to the other making one harder to push one than the other. that would make it harder for you to drive. There is a prodceeure for this in the operators manual. Mike

The drive handles are definitely not parallel with each other anymore. They're not off by a lot or anything, but they are off a bit. One drive handle returns to the neutral position quicker than the other one, which I think tells me that one of the shock dampeners in the linkage has more resistance than the other one.
The big question that I have is: Should the neutral adjustment have been made at the optimum operating RPM that the manual states?? The mechanic made the adjustment at 1750 RPM, and on page 2-19 of my operator's manual, it says, "for efficient loader operation of the hydrostatic pumps, maintain a full load engine speed of 2900 RPM or above".
So does that make a difference if he did the neutral adjustment at a much lower RPM??

 

[skidsteer.ca]

The drive handles are definitely not parallel with each other anymore. They're not off by a lot or anything, but they are off a bit. One drive handle returns to the neutral position quicker than the other one, which I think tells me that one of the shock dampeners in the linkage has more resistance than the other one.
The big question that I have is: Should the neutral adjustment have been made at the optimum operating RPM that the manual states?? The mechanic made the adjustment at 1750 RPM, and on page 2-19 of my operator's manual, it says, "for efficient loader operation of the hydrostatic pumps, maintain a full load engine speed of 2900 RPM or above".
So does that make a difference if he did the neutral adjustment at a much lower RPM??

I'm wondering if there is still air in the system (from the hose change) make the steering sticks feel jumpy and erratic. How long has it run since?
The neutral setting can be checked as Mike said, just put it on blocks. It should not creep regardless of engine rpm, high, low or otherwise.
Ken

 

[Finman]

I'm wondering if there is still air in the system (from the hose change) make the steering sticks feel jumpy and erratic. How long has it run since?
The neutral setting can be checked as Mike said, just put it on blocks. It should not creep regardless of engine rpm, high, low or otherwise.
Ken

I ran the machine for about 4 hours yesterday digging up some tree stumps and probably looked like an idiot doing so with how I was fighting the steering and stick control...
Not sure about the air in the system thing, as I just don't know enough about it... But I'm definitely learning more and more as I keep researching this issue!! I'll keep the air in the system in mind.
I called the dealer that did the work and the service manager was going to speak to the mechanic and then get back to me. I'm just not overly confident now with the mechanic there. I guess we'll see what they have to say...

 

[skidsteer.ca]

I ran the machine for about 4 hours yesterday digging up some tree stumps and probably looked like an idiot doing so with how I was fighting the steering and stick control...
Not sure about the air in the system thing, as I just don't know enough about it... But I'm definitely learning more and more as I keep researching this issue!! I'll keep the air in the system in mind.
I called the dealer that did the work and the service manager was going to speak to the mechanic and then get back to me. I'm just not overly confident now with the mechanic there. I guess we'll see what they have to say...

In 4 hours the any air should have been long gone. See what they say and offer to do. No adjustment to the steering levers should cause this to steer eradic. I wonder if they left something in the linkage loose which alows the hydro to jump to the speed it want independant of the steering lever position?? It has to be something along this line. I'd just give the chance to make it right, you spend your hard earned money after all. They should be able to fix it.
Ken

 

[mllud]

In 4 hours the any air should have been long gone. See what they say and offer to do. No adjustment to the steering levers should cause this to steer eradic. I wonder if they left something in the linkage loose which alows the hydro to jump to the speed it want independant of the steering lever position?? It has to be something along this line. I'd just give the chance to make it right, you spend your hard earned money after all. They should be able to fix it.
Ken

I dont know what engine you have but 2900 r.p.m. seem high . My lx865 ha a 3 cyl. ford and 2250 in where I like it.
If he didnt set those linkages right one side will not move the lever on the pump the same distance as the other one. I know because I did this on mine. I thought how hard can it be. Then I went and got the book and corrected my work.There is a step by step and a I followed the direction it made sence.You cant just pick a linkage to lengthen and center the pump. Both sides need to match in lengths fairly close.
My dad always told me as a last resort read the directions. mike

 

[Finman]

I dont know what engine you have but 2900 r.p.m. seem high . My lx865 ha a 3 cyl. ford and 2250 in where I like it.
If he didnt set those linkages right one side will not move the lever on the pump the same distance as the other one. I know because I did this on mine. I thought how hard can it be. Then I went and got the book and corrected my work.There is a step by step and a I followed the direction it made sence.You cant just pick a linkage to lengthen and center the pump. Both sides need to match in lengths fairly close.
My dad always told me as a last resort read the directions. mike

Yup, I totally agree with you that 2900 RPM sounds high, but that's what is written right in the operator's manual. I would usually run it around 2500 RPM or a little less. I would be curious to hear what New Holland would have to say about what is written in the manual with regards to that number.
I read the step by step sections in the manual on the neutral adjustment, the control lever parallel adjustment, and the control lever stop adjustment, but I wonder if the mechanic did...

 

[mllud]

I dont know what engine you have but 2900 r.p.m. seem high . My lx865 ha a 3 cyl. ford and 2250 in where I like it.
If he didnt set those linkages right one side will not move the lever on the pump the same distance as the other one. I know because I did this on mine. I thought how hard can it be. Then I went and got the book and corrected my work.There is a step by step and a I followed the direction it made sence.You cant just pick a linkage to lengthen and center the pump. Both sides need to match in lengths fairly close.
My dad always told me as a last resort read the directions. mike

I I remembered the shock damper on mine got sticky and would jerk and stick.It started after I adjutedthe lingth of the linkage right where at the linkage connects to that unit.I put it back where it was and it was fine. Both of those rods coming out under the shocks need to be even lengths. There is a adjustment for the spring tension and 2 grease fittings on that unit.
I hope they fix what they messed up.Mike

 

[skidsteer.ca]

I I remembered the shock damper on mine got sticky and would jerk and stick.It started after I adjutedthe lingth of the linkage right where at the linkage connects to that unit.I put it back where it was and it was fine. Both of those rods coming out under the shocks need to be even lengths. There is a adjustment for the spring tension and 2 grease fittings on that unit.
I hope they fix what they messed up.Mike

Most of the small Japanese diesels are governed at @ 3000 rpm where many north american engine run 2300 or so. My 160 and the bobcats run around 3000
Ken

 

[Finman]

Most of the small Japanese diesels are governed at @ 3000 rpm where many north american engine run 2300 or so. My 160 and the bobcats run around 3000
Ken

Well, I got a call back from the dealer this morning and the machine is going back to them later this mid morning. The mechanic said he spoke to his regional service rep. and explained everything to him and the rep said he may not have gotten all the correct information to do the neutral adjustment correctly. Whatever the case, I just told him that the machine steers worse than before any adjustments were made and I just want it steering and operating as well as it did when I brought it in.
The mechanic did mention that the shock dampeners may need to to be replaced since they don't return the sticks back at the same pace. One is a bit slower than the other on the return to the neutral position. I don't know if that has any major impact on the performance or not, but since New Holland is now involved with this issue, I guess I have to follow their suggestions and their lead on how to get this solved. Im just not too thrilled if it ends up costing me more money in parts for something that I didn't have a problem with to begin with. Guess we'll see what happens...

 

[skidsteer.ca]

Well, I got a call back from the dealer this morning and the machine is going back to them later this mid morning. The mechanic said he spoke to his regional service rep. and explained everything to him and the rep said he may not have gotten all the correct information to do the neutral adjustment correctly. Whatever the case, I just told him that the machine steers worse than before any adjustments were made and I just want it steering and operating as well as it did when I brought it in.
The mechanic did mention that the shock dampeners may need to to be replaced since they don't return the sticks back at the same pace. One is a bit slower than the other on the return to the neutral position. I don't know if that has any major impact on the performance or not, but since New Holland is now involved with this issue, I guess I have to follow their suggestions and their lead on how to get this solved. Im just not too thrilled if it ends up costing me more money in parts for something that I didn't have a problem with to begin with. Guess we'll see what happens...

"Im just not too thrilled if it ends up costing me more money in parts for something that I didn't have a problem with to begin with."
I hear you. This is one of those times when it depends on the shop. Some shops are just there to sell parts and others have the customers needs first. I don't send to much out to the shops. The shop I do use the most is not a dealer, just a equipment repair shop. He know me well, and does not go out of his way to sell things.
This is where a good understanding of the machine by the customer can help. When someone say I need a part, I want to be able to understand why I need it. Imo it is the shop job to fully justify the part to you, the customer.
Many times I have heard "you don't understand, but you need this...." to which I reply "explain it to me" In this situation it does not usually take me long to find out the truth. If they are rude or condesending in their explanation, they got my last dollar. I may not be able to change things this time around, but the next time I want some help, my memory is pretty good about how it went last time around.
Ken

 

[Finman]

"Im just not too thrilled if it ends up costing me more money in parts for something that I didn't have a problem with to begin with."
I hear you. This is one of those times when it depends on the shop. Some shops are just there to sell parts and others have the customers needs first. I don't send to much out to the shops. The shop I do use the most is not a dealer, just a equipment repair shop. He know me well, and does not go out of his way to sell things.
This is where a good understanding of the machine by the customer can help. When someone say I need a part, I want to be able to understand why I need it. Imo it is the shop job to fully justify the part to you, the customer.
Many times I have heard "you don't understand, but you need this...." to which I reply "explain it to me" In this situation it does not usually take me long to find out the truth. If they are rude or condesending in their explanation, they got my last dollar. I may not be able to change things this time around, but the next time I want some help, my memory is pretty good about how it went last time around.
Ken

Yeah, I agree with you there and want things explained to me also. So far I think the shop has been fair to me, but I don't want things to escalate into a "just replace it" situation because of an inept mechanic, or one that doesn't want to find the real problem, issue, or cause. While I definitely don't claim to be an expert mechanic or anything, I have plenty of mechanical aptitude, understanding, and the ability to do a lot of things myself, and prefer to do it that way, but finding the darn time to do something that I can handle on my own is always the problem...

 

[mllud]

Yeah, I agree with you there and want things explained to me also. So far I think the shop has been fair to me, but I don't want things to escalate into a "just replace it" situation because of an inept mechanic, or one that doesn't want to find the real problem, issue, or cause. While I definitely don't claim to be an expert mechanic or anything, I have plenty of mechanical aptitude, understanding, and the ability to do a lot of things myself, and prefer to do it that way, but finding the darn time to do something that I can handle on my own is always the problem...

That shock dampening system has to be right. It will bind if they arent right. The two shafts under that plate have to be equal lengths. Before you buy a shock he should start from scratch on adjusting that whole unit. Mike