1972 Bobcat 610 -- VH4D or VF4D

[Joey-D]

I just purchased a 1972 Bobcat 610. It has the Wisconsin 4 cylinder gas motor in it. Everything I have read on the internet says it has a VH4D engine. I just ordered an electric ignition conversion for a VH4D. Shortly after that, I was looking at the manual that came with the machine. It states 2 different specs for the machine. One page says it has the VH4D and the other says it has the VF4D. Which is it? I do not believe the ignition I bought fits the VF4D. Also, from what I read on the web, the VF4D is an pull start. Mine is definitely an electric start. So which motor do I have? http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/...5-80AC-49EF-BEEF-2A32C99C8F44_zps45iztzqv.jpg
http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/...1-9188-4020-AF94-4A31BF48F05C_zpsjrwuziea.jpg

 

[6brnorma]

If it is in fact a 610 (with original engine) it will be a VH4D. Either engine will fit. It is easy to tell by opening your distributor and looking at the lobes on the cam…….if they are evenly spaced (90 degrees) it is a VH4D, if they are not evenly spaced it is a VF4D. No 600 series Bobcats ever came with a 'pull' start. I don't believe any Bobcat of any kind ever came with a 'pull' start.

 

[mark18mwm]

Is there still ID tag on the shroud covering the head? Mine (M600) has the tag on it identifying it as a VH4D. If there is a tag there try to see what it says.

 

[6brnorma]

Is there still ID tag on the shroud covering the head? Mine (M600) has the tag on it identifying it as a VH4D. If there is a tag there try to see what it says.

Mark…..M600's…..if they came with a Wisconsin engine, came 'original' with a VF4D. "If" your 600 has a VH4D in it……it is a 'repower'. I would NOT depend on any ID tag on these engines…..I have a pile of about 20 shrouds with all sorts of ID tags on them (and so does anyone else that works on them regularly) that all fit the V4 series Wisconsin engines. Again……look inside the distributer at the lobes.

 

[Ceilingwalker]

Mark…..M600's…..if they came with a Wisconsin engine, came 'original' with a VF4D. "If" your 600 has a VH4D in it……it is a 'repower'. I would NOT depend on any ID tag on these engines…..I have a pile of about 20 shrouds with all sorts of ID tags on them (and so does anyone else that works on them regularly) that all fit the V4 series Wisconsin engines. Again……look inside the distributer at the lobes.

I know this is an old post but thought I would give it a shot. Are you saying to pull the entire distributor out to check?

 

[Ceilingwalker]

My 1973 M610 started making like a compression escape sound yesterday and now it doesn't want to turn-over at all. I have been diligent about checking the oil frequently because I know she's an old girl and want to take care of it. The guy I purchased it from was second owner and he told me it is all original and it has almost 15,000 hours on it.......farm hours. I am not sure if I just bury this machine and buy a new one or what.

 

[foton]

I wonder if the valves have ever been touched? They most likely need to be at least checked for clearance. a compression check might be in order first then the valves set and another compression test to see if you fixed anything. 15,000 hrs,,,, I wonder if someone left the key on and went on vacation.

 

[Jim A]

Head gaskets blew alot on these motors . Often grass debris clogged cooling fins .
I have a few motors for parts .

 

[Ceilingwalker]

I don't know the cylinder order of this machine and I only performed a dry test for now. The two cylinders opposite each other, on my left-hand side (at the rear of the machine) are at 35 and the two cylinders on the right-hand side are at 75.

 

[Ceilingwalker]

This tells me head gasket but I am by no means as experienced as you folks are. I have been having issues with the motor bogging down when I use my aux hydraulics since I bought it. What should the compression be for this motor? Thank you

 

[Ceilingwalker]

Also, the two cylinders that make it to 75, it takes a few cycles to get to 75 which leads me to believe the piston rings might be worn. Once, while using an auger attachment, the yard filled with white smoke from the exhaust, but only once. I dug 9 holes and it was on the first hole. Also, that lever that increases belt speed I had pushed it so it was at max speed. I am thinking about putting a clutch fan over the motor for cooling. I would prefer liquid cooled but I would like to keep the old girl as original as possible, I mean, she is 50 years old and the guy I bought it from told me it's all original, never been rebuilt or anything other than general maintenance.

 

[Ceilingwalker]

Okay, after performing the wet compression test and looking at the engine better, the head gasket theory of mine doesn't make sense. Wet test left the front left (standing at the rear of the machine) at 35, front-right at 90 after several rotations, rear-left at 60 after several rotations, and the rear-right at 90 after several rotations. I emphasize the "several rotations" because none of them jumped right up after a single compression stroke, it took several. Anyone know where I can get piston rings and valve seats and such? My local bobcat dealer said bobcat doesn't sell them anymore. Thanks

 

[foton]

get on the net and do a wisconsin engine parts search there is still people who have parts and have engine rebuilding service available. I know it is not the same but I had a TDJ maybe?18.2 hp 2 cylinder wisconsin engine and it had 105 psi on both and was told that pressure was not great but ok and leave it alone, I ran it for a few years trouble free, not any visable smoke but it did use some oil.

 

[haymaker]

Possible carbon on valve not allowing it to seat properly, or bad spring. I was lucky once when I thought I would be doing a valve and ring job because of a 50 pound difference in cylinders. Once the head got cleaned up the cylinders were all within 5 pounds of each other.
Good luck.

 

[Ceilingwalker]

Possible carbon on valve not allowing it to seat properly, or bad spring. I was lucky once when I thought I would be doing a valve and ring job because of a 50 pound difference in cylinders. Once the head got cleaned up the cylinders were all within 5 pounds of each other.
Good luck.

Did you have to pull the engine to get the heads off? There are two nuts, one on each head, that I can't see any way to get out without pulling the engine. I really want to put new piston rings on it, hone the cylinders and do a valve job to be sure I have done what I can.

 

[haymaker]

Sorry to imply it was one of these. It was on my first skid steer and Owatonna so long ago I don't remember which engine it had in it. I seem to recall it was the Wisconsin and I know that it was air cooled.
I would take it out if I were doing a rebuild. It is just so much easier to get at things and inspect my work. Also with an old machine I often find things that should be fixed I didn't know were in poor condition, preventing problems in the future.