I have a 1996 bobcat with a peugeot engine that won't start. This machine only has 2000hrs on it. This all began when I changed to a new muffler. I reinstall the old and still the same. Found some water in the fuel tank, drained the tank and added new fuel. I bled the fuel lines several times and still wouldn't start. I ran a seperate feed system other then the tank and used the primer ball. The machine started but only stayed running for about ten seconds. Did this several times and then hooked backed to the fuel tank. Still Wouldn't start. Lots of battery voltage. Tried quick start and still wouldn't fire. I'm hoping it's not serious. It just won't fire, need help bad. lots of snow arriving.
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bobbie-g
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First, go really easy with the start fluid. I don't want to state publically how I know this. I wouldn't recommend using it at all. Might be glow plugs not getting power, but probably not if you got it to run for 10 sec. There's a wire connecting all four glow plugs together. Put a voltmeter on that and see what you get when the key is first turned on. Should be around 10 or 11v until the glow plug relay drops out. The amber glow plug light should be illuminated also. Next, there is a fuel cut-off solenoid to the right side of the engine. The terminal on the top of it should have 12v on it to pull the solenoid out and let fuel flow. Also, there is a bleed screw on the top of the fuel filter and a bleed screw up higher, maybe on the injector/pump, I forget. Lemme know if you need more info and I'll run out and look at mine if that will help you. The axiom: if they have fuel, compression, and the timing belt isn't broken (should be replaced on that puppy at about 1000 hrs), they'll probably run. Oh yeah, one other possibility: there is a fuel pickup tube (conveniently located behind the engine completely out of sight) that can break off and quit sucking fuel. And it is possible that the lift pump is going bad. A way to check for the latter is to continually pump the bulb while getting it started and running. If it dies when you quit pumping, then it's probably the lift pump. If that's the case, holler and I can give you some info about that also.
---Bobbie G.Thanks bobbie-g. I know the timing belt has been replaced awhile ago. I ordered a pickup tube and just waiting on part. I'll let you know how things went. Thanks for reply.First, go really easy with the start fluid. I don't want to state publically how I know this. I wouldn't recommend using it at all. Might be glow plugs not getting power, but probably not if you got it to run for 10 sec. There's a wire connecting all four glow plugs together. Put a voltmeter on that and see what you get when the key is first turned on. Should be around 10 or 11v until the glow plug relay drops out. The amber glow plug light should be illuminated also. Next, there is a fuel cut-off solenoid to the right side of the engine. The terminal on the top of it should have 12v on it to pull the solenoid out and let fuel flow. Also, there is a bleed screw on the top of the fuel filter and a bleed screw up higher, maybe on the injector/pump, I forget. Lemme know if you need more info and I'll run out and look at mine if that will help you. The axiom: if they have fuel, compression, and the timing belt isn't broken (should be replaced on that puppy at about 1000 hrs), they'll probably run. Oh yeah, one other possibility: there is a fuel pickup tube (conveniently located behind the engine completely out of sight) that can break off and quit sucking fuel. And it is possible that the lift pump is going bad. A way to check for the latter is to continually pump the bulb while getting it started and running. If it dies when you quit pumping, then it's probably the lift pump. If that's the case, holler and I can give you some info about that also.
bobbie-g
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John, couple of things to check. First, replacing the pickup tube is a real chore, so let's make sure that's the problem. You said you tried running with another fuel source. It should run just fine that way, with a gallon of diesel in a can supplying the primer bulb or fuel filter. Next, I found when the pickup tube broke on my 863, I could tilt the machine slightly with the filler tube high, then add diesel until the filler tube was clear full and ready to run over. The Bobcat would run for several minutes that way, and I drove it a couple of miles back home by stopping every 3-4 minutes and adding more diesel in the filler port. So yours should act the same way. If you just let it run for a few minutes, it should die after it used all the fuel out of the fill hose. So if that happens, it probably is a broken line inside the tank. As I understand it, there is a rubber grommet in the fuel tank behind the left hand end of the engine where the supply tube connects to the tank. May be two similar connections, one for the return line from the injectors and one for the diesel supply line. Both will be under a bunch of dirt and grease. You should be able to find the fill line by having someone tug on the primer bulb while you reach behind the engine. I would advise replacing the fuel line between the elbow and the primer bulb since this will be the easiest time in your life to do so. I think when I had the muffler off, it gave me better access to that location (better is a relative term). When you go to the Bobcat place, consider getting another rubber grommet to install in the tank and have a look at an elbow they may have in stock, just to see what you are dealing with, since you'll never see it behind the tank. Good luck.
---Bobbie-GI have the engine running now BUT, it will only run if the hydraulic belt is taken off. When I put the drive belt back on, it will run for about 20seconds and shutdown. HELPJohn, couple of things to check. First, replacing the pickup tube is a real chore, so let's make sure that's the problem. You said you tried running with another fuel source. It should run just fine that way, with a gallon of diesel in a can supplying the primer bulb or fuel filter. Next, I found when the pickup tube broke on my 863, I could tilt the machine slightly with the filler tube high, then add diesel until the filler tube was clear full and ready to run over. The Bobcat would run for several minutes that way, and I drove it a couple of miles back home by stopping every 3-4 minutes and adding more diesel in the filler port. So yours should act the same way. If you just let it run for a few minutes, it should die after it used all the fuel out of the fill hose. So if that happens, it probably is a broken line inside the tank. As I understand it, there is a rubber grommet in the fuel tank behind the left hand end of the engine where the supply tube connects to the tank. May be two similar connections, one for the return line from the injectors and one for the diesel supply line. Both will be under a bunch of dirt and grease. You should be able to find the fill line by having someone tug on the primer bulb while you reach behind the engine. I would advise replacing the fuel line between the elbow and the primer bulb since this will be the easiest time in your life to do so. I think when I had the muffler off, it gave me better access to that location (better is a relative term). When you go to the Bobcat place, consider getting another rubber grommet to install in the tank and have a look at an elbow they may have in stock, just to see what you are dealing with, since you'll never see it behind the tank. Good luck.
When I do start it up she'll throw a lot of black smoke and then clean herself out and run smooth. As soon as I put that drive hydraulic belt on it'll run for about 30seconds and then die out.
The 30 seconds it runs, does it have any power? or is it only just running?
What is your oil level like? does it smell of fuel at all? Has the oil level risen?
Its possible your fuel shut off solenoid is acting up, but don't just go and replace it before confirming it. They Are REAL expensive.
When the machine is running, it's no problem to rev up and down. As soon as the belt is installed on the drive pump it will run for about 30seconds and then shut down. Thanks for your help.
I had changed the engine oil and everything's fine
Strange.
There was no speed sensor on these machines to shut the machine down if it detected a fault as far as i can remember.
Does the engine speed up if you give the primer bulb a good squeeze
I'll try that Tazza. I think the machine is actually stalling out when the drive belt is put back on rather then shutting down electrically.
Tazza, When I try to start the machine with the belt on, she'll only fire at quarter trottle. I tried full trottle but no go. All this problems started when I had water in the fuel from a major rain storm that went through our area. I drained the system, new fuel and filters. There was a time when I had her going previous that the hydraulics started to move on it's own but now I 'm back to the situation where she'll only run without the drive belt.
When the machine runs without the hyd. belt, it blows black smoke but runs smooth. I jacked up the machine and started it up. It ran for about a minuite and the all the hyds. work and then the machine stopped. It takes four or five cranks before it starts but runs again without the belt and it still blowing black smoke continously. I tried to squeeze the priming ball but it really doesn't seem to make any difference.
mrdeere1959
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could be it jumped time. $80.51 for a new timing belt
Checked the belt. OK. Had installed a new belt last year. this machine is used for snow clearing around the farm and a little cleanup. It has only 1700hrs on it
Is the machine inside where it can be warmed up? If water got in the fuel from the rain storm maybe there is water/ice in other places also.
OldMachinist
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- May 24, 2006
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The timing belt may look good but it could have jumped a couple of teeth.
The machine is stored in a heated garage right now. I will check the belt to see if it had jumped a tooth or more.
