Huge problem....rented bobcat stuck/won't run

nobull1 · Dec 30, 2007

switzforge said:
WOW!!! Sky Crane? Buy the skid steer and call it art? Sorry not much help, I'm jst glad no one got hurt riding that down the hill.. Would have been horrible if it had rolled and gone in upside down. Perhaps if there are some profesional logging equipment opperators. My wifes uncle used to tell a story about a D9 Cat sliding off a barge into the lake wehn he was logging in the pacific north west. They strung a cable accross the lake ran another cable from that down to the sunk Cat and hauled it back up and onto shore.

Is it possible with a snatch block or two to get it to stable ground? If you can get it on stable ground it could be worked on and hopefully started to help removal. Does it have to come up the hill at that point or could you cut a few trees and take it out at a different easier place?

T190stuck · Dec 30, 2007

nobull1 said:
Is it possible with a snatch block or two to get it to stable ground? If you can get it on stable ground it could be worked on and hopefully started to help removal. Does it have to come up the hill at that point or could you cut a few trees and take it out at a different easier place?

I could be wrong, but I think that if some trees are cut behind it that a long enough chain could be hooked to it. There is a trail wide enough for a bobcat that runs around the huge marsh/mud area and it gradually tapers down into flat land so it wouldn't have to be pulled up a very steep bank. It definitely can't go out the way it went in. I'll talk to him about cutting some trees. My dad is calling the owner of the rental company in the morning. This is not how I wanted to spend my time off from work/holiday.

BobCat · Dec 30, 2007

T190stuck said:
I could be wrong, but I think that if some trees are cut behind it that a long enough chain could be hooked to it. There is a trail wide enough for a bobcat that runs around the huge marsh/mud area and it gradually tapers down into flat land so it wouldn't have to be pulled up a very steep bank. It definitely can't go out the way it went in. I'll talk to him about cutting some trees. My dad is calling the owner of the rental company in the morning. This is not how I wanted to spend my time off from work/holiday.

After looking at the pictures I have to say WOW!! You are stuck but not doomed. IMHO you need to get that mud hole pumped out or perhaps build a 3 or 4 steel pole tripod over it and winch the front end up out of the mud, then throw something under the front of the track. Once you get her above the water/mud table you can get it runing. Then I think you stand a fighting chance. Again Good Luck BobCat.

nobull1 · Dec 30, 2007

T190stuck said:
I could be wrong, but I think that if some trees are cut behind it that a long enough chain could be hooked to it. There is a trail wide enough for a bobcat that runs around the huge marsh/mud area and it gradually tapers down into flat land so it wouldn't have to be pulled up a very steep bank. It definitely can't go out the way it went in. I'll talk to him about cutting some trees. My dad is calling the owner of the rental company in the morning. This is not how I wanted to spend my time off from work/holiday.

I wouldn't want to have to do this project either, especially when family is involved. Just make sure before you cut all the trees down you won't need them for hooking a chain to. Make sure to take a bunch of pictures for later viewing "Christmas 2007". As time passes it "probably"won't be as painful as it is now. Good luck and keep us posted.
Brian

xtreem3d · Dec 30, 2007

nobull1 said:
I wouldn't want to have to do this project either, especially when family is involved. Just make sure before you cut all the trees down you won't need them for hooking a chain to. Make sure to take a bunch of pictures for later viewing "Christmas 2007". As time passes it "probably"won't be as painful as it is now. Good luck and keep us posted.
Brian

i know it's a little hard to say exactly what we would do until we were there in person but my first thought if you can't get a machine to it is in pic 1221 the tree right behind the machine, i would try to attach a cable/chain to the front arm up by the bucket . i don't know if there is a release to allow the bucket arms to be lifted up to it's highest point or if you pull on the arm it will go up but that movement would give you good leverage to lift the front up enough to get something under the front part of the track( basically getting the machine level again). i might try to cut the tree behind the machine at a height that would allow the cable/chain to move properly you could cut a V or groove in the top part of the tree trunk after you have determined the best height. i guess you would need a tree or something a little farther back to anchor to. the tree behind the machine may not be strong enough(hard to tell from pic). you would also want to make sure as you get good leverage on the raise bucket arms that it doesn't force the rear of the track deeper in the mud. if all that worked you could then use the remaining tree truck to winch it backwards then cut it out of the way. good luck, everyone's pullin' for you ( no pun intended)

T190stuck · Dec 30, 2007

xtreem3d said:
i know it's a little hard to say exactly what we would do until we were there in person but my first thought if you can't get a machine to it is in pic 1221 the tree right behind the machine, i would try to attach a cable/chain to the front arm up by the bucket . i don't know if there is a release to allow the bucket arms to be lifted up to it's highest point or if you pull on the arm it will go up but that movement would give you good leverage to lift the front up enough to get something under the front part of the track( basically getting the machine level again). i might try to cut the tree behind the machine at a height that would allow the cable/chain to move properly you could cut a V or groove in the top part of the tree trunk after you have determined the best height. i guess you would need a tree or something a little farther back to anchor to. the tree behind the machine may not be strong enough(hard to tell from pic). you would also want to make sure as you get good leverage on the raise bucket arms that it doesn't force the rear of the track deeper in the mud. if all that worked you could then use the remaining tree truck to winch it backwards then cut it out of the way. good luck, everyone's pullin' for you ( no pun intended)

When the bobcat was still running we hooked a chain from the bucket to that tree behind it and lowered the bucket to try to lift the front of the bobcat up. The tree started to bend some...so that didn't work. If we could get the bucket up using some release then that might help like you say to get the front pulled up---if we can get it hooked to something to pull it. There is a crew coming tomorrow morning with some equipment. I'm not sure what they are bringing exactly, but I'm praying they can get it out. I plan on taking pics as we attempt to get it out. I feel kind of bad for the woods b/c they are getting wrecked with all this, but I don't see an alternative. I appreciate all the support. Cam

Fishfiles · Dec 30, 2007

T190stuck said:
When the bobcat was still running we hooked a chain from the bucket to that tree behind it and lowered the bucket to try to lift the front of the bobcat up. The tree started to bend some...so that didn't work. If we could get the bucket up using some release then that might help like you say to get the front pulled up---if we can get it hooked to something to pull it. There is a crew coming tomorrow morning with some equipment. I'm not sure what they are bringing exactly, but I'm praying they can get it out. I plan on taking pics as we attempt to get it out. I feel kind of bad for the woods b/c they are getting wrecked with all this, but I don't see an alternative. I appreciate all the support. Cam

That is a bad situation, have seen alot worst , those dead tracks buried under the mud / water has got to have a lot of suction going on , and it you try to go back wards it looks like it will pull right into the roots of that tree , the longer it sits there the more in will probally sink unless you get lucky and it's on top of some roots, also the longer it sits the more chance you have of water coming up and floodig the engine , I would think at this point from the level it sits the fuse panel has burned out the power wires off the back of the fuse panel that are not on the accesory side and live all the time and that is why you can't get it running , but I doubt from the way it looks that if it were runing at this point that you still wouldn't get out ---------I would think that the machine would stay on rent till it is back up running and rentable at the rental houses yard , so time is money , then longer it sits the more it's going to cost and the greater chance of more damages , without the motor running I don't think you will do any good with chain falls or comealongs unless you hire a crew of Egyptian pyraid builders , I think you will need an excavator to lift it up and get wood under it , then try to pull it to shore , I'd almost wonder if it is best not to call the rental house if you can come up with a plan on your own , I doubt seriously that they will come out and get it out free of charge and if you can get it out and get it running and power washed clean on your own without telling them what happened you may come out alot cheaper as if the wiring is burned at the back the box the right way to fix it is a new harness as the fuse box is wired into it as an assembly , I can tell you how to repair the wires with out replacing the harness but the rental house probally wouldn't go for it as the machine looks farely new and they will probally stick it to you'll pretty good

T190stuck · Dec 30, 2007

Fishfiles said:
That is a bad situation, have seen alot worst , those dead tracks buried under the mud / water has got to have a lot of suction going on , and it you try to go back wards it looks like it will pull right into the roots of that tree , the longer it sits there the more in will probally sink unless you get lucky and it's on top of some roots, also the longer it sits the more chance you have of water coming up and floodig the engine , I would think at this point from the level it sits the fuse panel has burned out the power wires off the back of the fuse panel that are not on the accesory side and live all the time and that is why you can't get it running , but I doubt from the way it looks that if it were runing at this point that you still wouldn't get out ---------I would think that the machine would stay on rent till it is back up running and rentable at the rental houses yard , so time is money , then longer it sits the more it's going to cost and the greater chance of more damages , without the motor running I don't think you will do any good with chain falls or comealongs unless you hire a crew of Egyptian pyraid builders , I think you will need an excavator to lift it up and get wood under it , then try to pull it to shore , I'd almost wonder if it is best not to call the rental house if you can come up with a plan on your own , I doubt seriously that they will come out and get it out free of charge and if you can get it out and get it running and power washed clean on your own without telling them what happened you may come out alot cheaper as if the wiring is burned at the back the box the right way to fix it is a new harness as the fuse box is wired into it as an assembly , I can tell you how to repair the wires with out replacing the harness but the rental house probally wouldn't go for it as the machine looks farely new and they will probally stick it to you'll pretty good

While I halfway agree with you that it might not be the best idea to tell the rental company, I think on the other hand they may should know. I mean I expect that the owner will charge in full for the days out, but it's hard to say for sure until he's been spoken to. If he has any kind of a heart, I'm hoping that just maybe he'll give my dad a break. One of the guys that is coming tomorrow said he's pretty sure he can get the bobcat running, but he hasn't seen how bad the situation is first hand. I'm going to tell him what I know to help him out. The crew is bringing some 40k lb machine (I forgot what he called it) to help get it out. I don't know what else they are bringing. If we get it out and it does happen to be an electrical problem, my dad should be able to repair it since he's an electrician. I don't want him to have to pay anymore money for this ordeal than he has to. I'm hoping I can post some good news tomorrow.

877skidsteer · Dec 30, 2007

I have been watching this forum for quite some time and feel compelled to comment on this one. Your situation sucks, but is not hopeless. You have gotten many good suggestions from knowledgeable operators. As a rental center owner and also operator, I would recommend notifying the store, but also try this to remove the machine from the mud. (It will be much cheaper if you accomplish this) It is important to raise the rear tracks out of the muck. The t190 is heavier in the back, and will also be easier to drive out of that mud backwards. This can be achieved fairly easily by using two 2"x12"x4' pieces of board and a good three ton floor jack. The boards provide stability for the floor jack. You will need to remove enough muck with a shovel to allow for clearance on the two boards and floor jack to fit between the earth and the bottom rear of the machine. Make sure the floor jack is not angled or it can give way as it raises. Once in place, one side of the machine can be raised out of the mud and supported with logs, concrete, stone, etc. Repeat for the right side. Once the machine is running, the bucket can be used to push the front end up while simultaneously driving backwards with the tracks. You will likely need to use additional boards to then walk the machine out of the mud backwards with the combined movements of pushing the bucket out while reversing the tracks. You will be surprised, but this will work as we have done this a number of times over the years with our 864 Bobcat track machines which are heavier than the 190. Also, make sure that the tracks are properly tensioned with grease as you definitely do not want to be reinstalling a track down there. A half tube of grease can potentially save you from another headache. Good luck!

owensge · Dec 30, 2007

877skidsteer said:
I have been watching this forum for quite some time and feel compelled to comment on this one. Your situation sucks, but is not hopeless. You have gotten many good suggestions from knowledgeable operators. As a rental center owner and also operator, I would recommend notifying the store, but also try this to remove the machine from the mud. (It will be much cheaper if you accomplish this) It is important to raise the rear tracks out of the muck. The t190 is heavier in the back, and will also be easier to drive out of that mud backwards. This can be achieved fairly easily by using two 2"x12"x4' pieces of board and a good three ton floor jack. The boards provide stability for the floor jack. You will need to remove enough muck with a shovel to allow for clearance on the two boards and floor jack to fit between the earth and the bottom rear of the machine. Make sure the floor jack is not angled or it can give way as it raises. Once in place, one side of the machine can be raised out of the mud and supported with logs, concrete, stone, etc. Repeat for the right side. Once the machine is running, the bucket can be used to push the front end up while simultaneously driving backwards with the tracks. You will likely need to use additional boards to then walk the machine out of the mud backwards with the combined movements of pushing the bucket out while reversing the tracks. You will be surprised, but this will work as we have done this a number of times over the years with our 864 Bobcat track machines which are heavier than the 190. Also, make sure that the tracks are properly tensioned with grease as you definitely do not want to be reinstalling a track down there. A half tube of grease can potentially save you from another headache. Good luck!

I retrieved my t200 out of a pond using this same procedure.

Fishfiles · Dec 31, 2007

owensge said:
I retrieved my t200 out of a pond using this same procedure.

An important point I forgot to mention , it may be too late for you now but can't hurt , and making a note of it could help someone in the furtue , always disconnect the battery cable as soon as possible if machine is getting wet , once the wire connections get wet and short out it will eat away at the wiring and connections till it breaks away all contact with the battery , so the quicker you do it the less damage to the wiring ---------after the flood of huricane Katrina I got a lot of first hand experiences in flood recovery of machinery , I quickly noticed that all the machines that have safety relays swiches between the batteries and the electriacl sysytem like the Deers and Komatsus had no damage to water shorting out and burning of wiring and fuse boxes , also boat engines that had a battery switch turned to the off position were protected , but all the machines that had voltage going thru the wiring had extensive damage to the wires

T190stuck · Dec 31, 2007

Fishfiles said:
An important point I forgot to mention , it may be too late for you now but can't hurt , and making a note of it could help someone in the furtue , always disconnect the battery cable as soon as possible if machine is getting wet , once the wire connections get wet and short out it will eat away at the wiring and connections till it breaks away all contact with the battery , so the quicker you do it the less damage to the wiring ---------after the flood of huricane Katrina I got a lot of first hand experiences in flood recovery of machinery , I quickly noticed that all the machines that have safety relays swiches between the batteries and the electriacl sysytem like the Deers and Komatsus had no damage to water shorting out and burning of wiring and fuse boxes , also boat engines that had a battery switch turned to the off position were protected , but all the machines that had voltage going thru the wiring had extensive damage to the wires

It's out!!! It still doesn't run, but it's probably something in the fuse box. For pics, copy and paste this link: http://s16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/Camshaft2/Bobcat%20Fiasco/ They are in reverse order, so if you want to watch the progression of it being pulled out, start at page 2 and then go to page 1. Even that huge beast of a machine had to use a winch to get up one portion of a hill down there b/c it started to sink in/spin. Thanks for all your guys' help, Cam

nobull1 · Dec 31, 2007

T190stuck said:
It's out!!! It still doesn't run, but it's probably something in the fuse box. For pics, copy and paste this link: http://s16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/Camshaft2/Bobcat%20Fiasco/ They are in reverse order, so if you want to watch the progression of it being pulled out, start at page 2 and then go to page 1. Even that huge beast of a machine had to use a winch to get up one portion of a hill down there b/c it started to sink in/spin. Thanks for all your guys' help, Cam

Glad to see you have it out. Hopefully it doesn't have too many electrical problems.

xtreem3d · Dec 31, 2007

nobull1 said:
Glad to see you have it out. Hopefully it doesn't have too many electrical problems.

congrats !! what happened with the rental comapny?

BobCat · Dec 31, 2007

xtreem3d said:
congrats !! what happened with the rental comapny?

All Right!! Glad to hear it. I didn't know what sort of resources you had available to you. Comealong Hell!! Hope ya get her running soon and the rental company goes easy on ya. I have to admit, it makes me a little wary of buying a used machine from a rental company now, grin grin. Take care BobCat.

owensge · Dec 31, 2007

BobCat said:
All Right!! Glad to hear it. I didn't know what sort of resources you had available to you. Comealong Hell!! Hope ya get her running soon and the rental company goes easy on ya. I have to admit, it makes me a little wary of buying a used machine from a rental company now, grin grin. Take care BobCat.

switzforge · Dec 31, 2007

T190stuck said:
It's out!!! It still doesn't run, but it's probably something in the fuse box. For pics, copy and paste this link: http://s16.photobucket.com/albums/b26/Camshaft2/Bobcat%20Fiasco/ They are in reverse order, so if you want to watch the progression of it being pulled out, start at page 2 and then go to page 1. Even that huge beast of a machine had to use a winch to get up one portion of a hill down there b/c it started to sink in/spin. Thanks for all your guys' help, Cam

HIP HIP HORRAY!!. Well done.

porta mill · Dec 31, 2007

switzforge said:
HIP HIP HORRAY!!. Well done.

all I can s say is O BOY next is get it loaded and drive it to the car wash and you better have a quite a few quarters . one good thing it is out of the mud!!!!!! good luck with the rental Co. hope they go easy on you . keep us poasted would like to hear how it all turns out.

sandhills-elect · Dec 31, 2007

Glad to see you got it out okay and know one had to get hert or killed in the whole ordeal. Equipment is fixable or replaceable and people are not, hope your New Year goes better and Have a happy one. Brent.

Fishfiles · Dec 31, 2007

Way to go getting it out , I am kinda guess at where you would be at now and if you have a battery load tester that is where I would start , then I'd check all the fuses visually by pulling them one at a time and see if any are blown or corrided on the spades , a test lght probally won't do you any good as I doubt you could power up the dash , there is a 100 amp fuse in a plastic box above the battery , follow the batterry cable up to locate that , if you find fuse problems and relacing them doesn't give you power , you can use a screw driver and some spray lube on the rubber around the fuse box and pry the box with the rubber boot out away from the sheet metal , you got just enough slack to get it out and peel back the rubber boot that goes around the fuse box which will expose the back of the fuse panel , , I would bet that is where you will see some of the wires broke of the terminals on back the box , if so try and solder a piece of wire to the terminal on back the box and to the wire that broke off or if you can't do that get a inline fuse holder and wire a fuse in , you can pass the wire thru a hole in the box and let the fuse holder lay inside the cover -----I know you have to feel better already

Huge problem....rented bobcat stuck/won't run

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