864 Overheating in cold temps

[ValhallaForest]

I have a 2000 864 with 3700 hours that is overheating. I checked the radiators and sure enough they were full of debris. I cleaned and ran and within a few minutes it started to overheat again. Also, and not sure if related, but the glow plug indicator was flashing so I swapped relay with lights, checked connections and that seemed to resolve the glow plug issue, but again after running for less than an hour I am still getting to the yellow line and it is low 20's. Can't afford to burn up the motor but gotta move snow. What can I try?

 

[Tlawdogg]

Does it have a fan? If so, check Belt. When on, is it blowing air out the sides?
Do you have a temperament gun? If so ,see how hot it actually is running.

 

[ValhallaForest]

I ordered a laser thermometer and will be able to check temps next weekend. I will check fan condition tomorrow. The fan would be mounted under the engine oil radiator correct?

 

[Tlawdogg]

On my 863f with rear open, the fan pulley/belt are on the left side looking towards front. My belt Tensioner seized up and mine ran in yellow until I replaced pulley & belt. Should be same as 864.
I believe where the diesel cap location the fan should be blowing lots of Air out that area..both sides. The fan should be in the center area of engine compartment.

 

[foton]

once you verify that it is overheating , it could be a faulty thermostat, if it is not overheating it could be a faulty temp. sensor. and other things too.

 

[haymaker]

Slipping belt is a common issue especially with an older machine. The side air vent area having an obstruction is also common.
It does not take much slippage or restriction of air flow to cause you to run hot, if you have a combination of both, well I'm' sure you get it.
The thermostat on an older machine is also a good point, as foton said.
Rust and debris in radiator is not good. Poor lubrication from old tired antifreeze is a common reason for water pump failures. Seems to be one of the most neglected PM items.
I hope it is a simple fix. Not fun changing out the pater pump.

 

[thegoatguy00]

It's a oil cooled engine look for the 4 ports by the starter the two that don't have "in" and "out" next to them take them apart there oil pressure relief and temp regulator valves clean them and look for foreign debris in the springs. The springs could also be weak that was the problem with my bobcat 873 same engine as the 864

 

[haymaker]

It's a oil cooled engine look for the 4 ports by the starter the two that don't have "in" and "out" next to them take them apart there oil pressure relief and temp regulator valves clean them and look for foreign debris in the springs. The springs could also be weak that was the problem with my bobcat 873 same engine as the 864

Now this is exactly why we come here. This is information that someone that has the machine would know but someone new to the machine would waste a great deal of time before figuring it out!
Thanks Goat

 

[oiu789]

Let us know what you found!

 

[ValhallaForest]

Looks like my fan is not running. I won't be able to dive into that until this weekend, so any advice on getting to the fan belt and any pulleys I may need to get before going off grid again would be appreciated.

 

[Tlawdogg]

Is belt frayed or broken? Also keep in mind there is a spot to put I think 85w gear oil in with the fan shaft....Hopefully someone confirms this. That is done with cab up. I did that years ago.
The Tensioner is available everywhere. Ebay, ect. See if you can get the belt number off of your old one. Usually just the tensioner that goes bad. Once you get into the fix, see if you can rotate the fan by hand to confirm it's not the problem too.
Hopefully just a tensioner kit & belt and you are back in business!
I added some pictures for you including the bobcat picture. 90w is what it calls for...NOT 85w...

 

[ValhallaForest]

Is belt frayed or broken? Also keep in mind there is a spot to put I think 85w gear oil in with the fan shaft....Hopefully someone confirms this. That is done with cab up. I did that years ago.
The Tensioner is available everywhere. Ebay, ect. See if you can get the belt number off of your old one. Usually just the tensioner that goes bad. Once you get into the fix, see if you can rotate the fan by hand to confirm it's not the problem too.
Hopefully just a tensioner kit & belt and you are back in business!
I added some pictures for you including the bobcat picture. 90w is what it calls for...NOT 85w...

Thank you for the photos. I have been going through the service manual and the black and white photos are not great, and there is no exploded view to tell me where to even start looking for the drive tension pulley. Do I need to raise the operator cab to remove the fan drive belt or will I be able to reach the tensioner pulley from the rear of the bobcat? It looks like I need to raise the cab to check and fill gearbox lube level so wondering if all work can be done with raised cab. 24 year old service manual is lacking in some important details.

 

[Tlawdogg]

I did almost all of it from top (cab up) for the fan belt. Side note: if your Drive belt needs to be replaced NOW would be the time! I did them both at same time. That is mostly from the rear of skid steer. I removed the battery to make room. ( I think its a must to get the cover off) Glad I did, it was pretty worn..
The drive belt goes on before the fan belt if so. Here are pictures looking from rear forward. One picture is it complete. The other is cover off no fan belt.

 

[ValhallaForest]

I did almost all of it from top (cab up) for the fan belt. Side note: if your Drive belt needs to be replaced NOW would be the time! I did them both at same time. That is mostly from the rear of skid steer. I removed the battery to make room. ( I think its a must to get the cover off) Glad I did, it was pretty worn..
The drive belt goes on before the fan belt if so.

I ordered a tensioner kit and the drive belt but didn't see a fan belt. I thought the drive belt was the fan belt? Everything in the service manual only refers to the fan drive belt.

 

[Tlawdogg]

No, two different belts...the drive belt is big and has like 4 rows. Fan belt is like a regular belt.
You see the Fan tensioner & belt on left picture. The drive belt in right picture..

 

[ValhallaForest]

No, two different belts...the drive belt is big and has like 4 rows. Fan belt is like a regular belt.

I think I am seeing this now. The manual refers to a drive belt or pump drive belt (rear of machine) and a cooling fan drive belt (cab raised). I ordered both with the tensioner kit. Hopefully the tensioner pulley for the pump drive belt isn't worn...

 

[Tlawdogg]

The tensioner kit Should have a new Pulley!
It's what goes bad on the fan belt system.
Check the kit. Usually $45-50 us $ .

 

[ValhallaForest]

The tensioner kit Should have a new Pulley!
It what goes bad on the fan belt system.
Check the kit. Usually $45-50 us $ .

The tensioner kit has the pulley for the cooling fan drive belt. The hydraulic pump drive belt has a different tensioner pulley and frankly looks more straightforward to replace than the tensioner pulley kit for the cooling fan drive belt. Now all I can do is hope I get everything by Friday so I can get to work on this on Saturday. First time raising cab for me too. Looking forward to getting this done so I can clear snow before more comes. I really appreciate your help!

I will need to take some pictures of the process and may have my son shoot a start to finish video to post on YouTube as I really couldn't find a video out there for this issue. I am actually concerned about what I may need to remove before I can actually get the battery out as that is very tight space. The previous owner installed a power disconnect switch to save the battery, but definitely adds to the complexity.

 

[Tlawdogg]

Fingers crossed for you. Was pretty straight forward. Good luck and keep us Posted.
Yes, pictures are Helpful. Before, during & after!

 

[ValhallaForest]

So... I genuinely intended to send a follow up to this thread when I fixed the overheating issue, but you know what that say about good intentions.

I ordered and received the tensioner kit, got the cab lifted up and propped open and got as dirty as I possibly could. I had to attack the replacement of the belt from both the front and the rear. I'm not a large guy, and frankly I'm not sure how anyone with a larger frame and larger hands than me could have gotten the new belt on, unless they were Reed Richards of the Fantastic Four. The act of getting the tensioner pulley pulled in all the way in order to get the new belt on was a feat in and of itself. Actually getting the new belt on the new pulley was at least a 15 cuss word job. I have the new pulley and spring still sitting in the box that came with the kit thinking that if I ever run into this issue again, I will need to do even more disassembly, build a few new tools and complete a thorough Google search for new cuss words to employ.

Thank you to everyone who helped with this issue. Next time I would appreciate it if you would make a trip to Colorado to show me first hand how to do the job the right way.