T190 help

[thedassler]

Hi All, I am new to the forum and joined because I have been reading some of the older posts in the forum about some problems I have been having with my (new to me) T190. I have tried to piece together all the info and have trouble shot the problem but am still unsuccessful in having the machine back up and running. I guess it is time to call on the experts! The long and the short of it is...I bought a 2007 T190 high-flow with around 2600 hours and ACS. The machine looks a bit shabby but runs and operated fine. Not knowing the history on the machine, I decided to do a full service and changed all the fluids and all the filters (still need to change the drive motor oil). I changed to main drive belt and the alternator belt as well. The good news is it appears that the machine was likely serviced regularly as all the fluids although not new, looked to be in good order. The hydraulic oil was a few litre's low, however I have found no obvious leaks. After topping off all the fluids with new, bleeding the diesel system, she started up runs like a kitten but gives me no lift or tilt and lights up my ACS error light on the panel. I have had several codes over the last week including 32-34, 32-65, which lead me to pull the lower actuator. The actuator is from 2015. It runs fine and I re-calibrated it with a 5volt power supply to 1.72 volts when in the middle position (arm flush with housing). I put the actuator back in, had a single 32-34 code, and preformed the manual calibration procedure. I then got a 32-39, 32-65 set of codes. So...I pulled the upper actuator which is original (but of the same design as the newer one) tested and re-calibrated it. In fact, I for consistency sake, benched both at the same time and calibrated them match. Tried several times the manual calibration procedure, but it always lights up the ACS light and throws me a single 32-39 code. I tried to trick the system by switching the plugs (thinking that if the calibration procedure worked on only one, I might trick it into calibrating the other and now after returning everything back to where it should be, I am consistently back to 32-34. Incidentally, I did turn the key to the run position while leaving first one, then the other actuator unplugged to verify that the actuator noise that I hear when I first set the key in the run position is occurring with both and not just one actuator) OK...please if anyone has any great idea's or see's a major fault in my procedures, I would be grateful. Oh and one last comment because of what I have read from previous forums I realise that I might simply have to have the dealer calibrate the machine with a computer. However I live in Germany and these crazy Germans are only now beginning to see the benefit of the skid steer. as a result there are not that many around. I did speak to the dealer I purchased my parts from, and they are +- $1000.00 just to drive out and nearly a hundred miles for me to take it to them (I don't own a big enough vehicle to legally tow it to the dealer) So that is why I am seeking the collective thought of the forum, I want to make sure I have all my I's crossed and Tees dotted before either have someone come to me or pack it to them. Thanks for your help.

 

[Tazza]

Sadly you may have no option but to get it to the dealer..... ACS systems some times need a computer to get going right, one that only the dealer has.
Can you hire a truck to get it to the dealer to get them to hook a computer up to it?
New actuators generally need a re-flash of the computer software.
Hopefully someone here can give you better advise.

 

[thedassler]

Sadly you may have no option but to get it to the dealer..... ACS systems some times need a computer to get going right, one that only the dealer has.
Can you hire a truck to get it to the dealer to get them to hook a computer up to it?
New actuators generally need a re-flash of the computer software.
Hopefully someone here can give you better advise.

Thanks Tazza, So far, you are confirming what I suspected, I am looking into renting a truck to hall it to Frankfort. I wasn't sure if someone might see something I missed, for example the values coming out of the actuator, I have them set to 1.72 volts, have you or anyone else heard that that might not be right? Regardless, Thanks for the reply!

 

[BC873G]

Thanks Tazza, So far, you are confirming what I suspected, I am looking into renting a truck to hall it to Frankfort. I wasn't sure if someone might see something I missed, for example the values coming out of the actuator, I have them set to 1.72 volts, have you or anyone else heard that that might not be right? Regardless, Thanks for the reply!

Hi, here are a few things I would try before hauling it to Frankfort.

1. You said you calibrated the actuators. Did you check the neutral voltage after you reinstalled them to see if they still measure 1.72 volts? From my experience the input voltage from the controller has not been exactly 5 volts and they seem to respond to input proportionally. My experience is with an AHC controller though.

2. When you had the actuators off did you check to make sure the spool valves returned to center easily? If not the spools could be sticking and would result in the same error.

3. Make sure you tighten the actuator bolts evenly. They have tendency to be mis-aligned and binding can result. When I replaced mine I removed the control panel so I had a lot of room from the top to access them.

4. Did you swap the actuators from lift to tilt when you reinstalled them? If you do remove them check the centering of the spool values I would swap them and see if error code moves to 32-39 consistently. That would be more of indication that the actuator is bad. Were your spool valve seals leaking at all?

Good luck and hope this helps to keep you from hauling it in.

 

[7LBSSMALLIE]

Hi, here are a few things I would try before hauling it to Frankfort.

1. You said you calibrated the actuators. Did you check the neutral voltage after you reinstalled them to see if they still measure 1.72 volts? From my experience the input voltage from the controller has not been exactly 5 volts and they seem to respond to input proportionally. My experience is with an AHC controller though.

2. When you had the actuators off did you check to make sure the spool valves returned to center easily? If not the spools could be sticking and would result in the same error.

3. Make sure you tighten the actuator bolts evenly. They have tendency to be mis-aligned and binding can result. When I replaced mine I removed the control panel so I had a lot of room from the top to access them.

4. Did you swap the actuators from lift to tilt when you reinstalled them? If you do remove them check the centering of the spool values I would swap them and see if error code moves to 32-39 consistently. That would be more of indication that the actuator is bad. Were your spool valve seals leaking at all?

Good luck and hope this helps to keep you from hauling it in.

tazz covered it all. the only thing id add. upon initial tear down did actuators have oil in them idealy if installing actuators go ahead and reseal valve.20 bucks in parts. ouportiny to to inspect (does spool slide in bore? does float detent work etc, 20 bucks in parts no brainer. might answer a few questins. the benift of this is now you know its done, and twenty bucks beats a 700 actuator.

 

[thedassler]

Hi, here are a few things I would try before hauling it to Frankfort.

1. You said you calibrated the actuators. Did you check the neutral voltage after you reinstalled them to see if they still measure 1.72 volts? From my experience the input voltage from the controller has not been exactly 5 volts and they seem to respond to input proportionally. My experience is with an AHC controller though.

2. When you had the actuators off did you check to make sure the spool valves returned to center easily? If not the spools could be sticking and would result in the same error.

3. Make sure you tighten the actuator bolts evenly. They have tendency to be mis-aligned and binding can result. When I replaced mine I removed the control panel so I had a lot of room from the top to access them.

4. Did you swap the actuators from lift to tilt when you reinstalled them? If you do remove them check the centering of the spool values I would swap them and see if error code moves to 32-39 consistently. That would be more of indication that the actuator is bad. Were your spool valve seals leaking at all?

Good luck and hope this helps to keep you from hauling it in.

Ok, thanks to BC873G for the reply! I will answer in order...No, No, Yes, and No. I could also throw in a maybe to be safe. 1. Actually it never occurred to me to check the voltage after I reinstalled the actuators. But it should be easy enough to do with some jumper leads and check the voltage of the output while the ignition in the "Run"position. 2. When you refer to checking if the spool valves returning to center easily, Do you mean pushing or pulling on the where the actuator connects to the control valve, or the movement in the gear driven arm of the actuator? Sorry if that is a dumb question 3. I have found it easier to work on when the front panel is out of the machine. and yes, from previous posts I have read, I have tried to ensure that I tighten the actuators up evenly. 4. No, I have only swapped the cable connectors in trying to determine if the fail was a result of the actuator or related to the wiring harness. However, I like the idea and as I am now a professional at removing the steering panel (have it down to less than 5 minutes) I might just do it for shits and giggles. As for the spool valve seals leaking? (Hummm just answered my own dumb question from number 2) They are dry and clean. I assume that when I remove the actuator, the position of the spool valve is in the neutral position? Can I simply just gently push or pull on the valve rod? Ok, I will follow your suggestions tomorrow morning and let you all know what I find. Oh, and while I am at it, when I type my post and or reply, I space it out so it is easier to read, as yours is... but when I post it, it removes all my editing and leaves it looking like one long run on paragraph. What is the trick you used in writing your reply?

 

[thedassler]

Ok, thanks to BC873G for the reply! I will answer in order...No, No, Yes, and No. I could also throw in a maybe to be safe. 1. Actually it never occurred to me to check the voltage after I reinstalled the actuators. But it should be easy enough to do with some jumper leads and check the voltage of the output while the ignition in the "Run"position. 2. When you refer to checking if the spool valves returning to center easily, Do you mean pushing or pulling on the where the actuator connects to the control valve, or the movement in the gear driven arm of the actuator? Sorry if that is a dumb question 3. I have found it easier to work on when the front panel is out of the machine. and yes, from previous posts I have read, I have tried to ensure that I tighten the actuators up evenly. 4. No, I have only swapped the cable connectors in trying to determine if the fail was a result of the actuator or related to the wiring harness. However, I like the idea and as I am now a professional at removing the steering panel (have it down to less than 5 minutes) I might just do it for shits and giggles. As for the spool valve seals leaking? (Hummm just answered my own dumb question from number 2) They are dry and clean. I assume that when I remove the actuator, the position of the spool valve is in the neutral position? Can I simply just gently push or pull on the valve rod? Ok, I will follow your suggestions tomorrow morning and let you all know what I find. Oh, and while I am at it, when I type my post and or reply, I space it out so it is easier to read, as yours is... but when I post it, it removes all my editing and leaves it looking like one long run on paragraph. What is the trick you used in writing your reply?

Hi 7LBSSMALLIE, Thanks for your help. As I just responded to BC873G, the actuators were dry and clean and there appears to be no oil leaks from the spool valves. I will pull them again tomorrow and test pushing and or pulling gently on the spool valve rod to see if they spring back into what I assume is the neutral position. Not sure what the float detent is. I barely have an hour on the machine since I bought it. I started with my maintenance trying to prevent any expensive repairs (this is where I would add the laughing/crying happy face if I had one). As far as I know, the machine has "float" controls, but I have yet to use them and not even sure after reading the instruction in French-German, and then in English, that I even know how. But I am sure I will get the hang of it if I can ever get past the current pest of a problem. Incidentally, thru a friend who's brother is a mechanic for construction and farm machines (but not specifically for bobcat) I was able to procure a copy of bobcat's service manual covering the serial number of my machine, and this has a completely different manual calibration technique than what I previously read in the forum. Does anyone have any experience with the different technique's? I only had a few minutes today and tried the new sequence, but it requires that the solenoids are not locked and as the ACS light is on, naturally they are. I did use a small screwdriver to gently press threw the locking hole the solenoid end and free up the hand controls, but I am not sure if that actually didn't change my sequence as I had to free them up and hold them toward center before putting the key in the "run" position. I will see if I can get an extra hand in the shop tomorrow and maybe try it again. Non the less, you all have given me some good advice that I will try to test out tomorrow. Thanks!!

 

[BC873G]

Ok, thanks to BC873G for the reply! I will answer in order...No, No, Yes, and No. I could also throw in a maybe to be safe. 1. Actually it never occurred to me to check the voltage after I reinstalled the actuators. But it should be easy enough to do with some jumper leads and check the voltage of the output while the ignition in the "Run"position. 2. When you refer to checking if the spool valves returning to center easily, Do you mean pushing or pulling on the where the actuator connects to the control valve, or the movement in the gear driven arm of the actuator? Sorry if that is a dumb question 3. I have found it easier to work on when the front panel is out of the machine. and yes, from previous posts I have read, I have tried to ensure that I tighten the actuators up evenly. 4. No, I have only swapped the cable connectors in trying to determine if the fail was a result of the actuator or related to the wiring harness. However, I like the idea and as I am now a professional at removing the steering panel (have it down to less than 5 minutes) I might just do it for shits and giggles. As for the spool valve seals leaking? (Hummm just answered my own dumb question from number 2) They are dry and clean. I assume that when I remove the actuator, the position of the spool valve is in the neutral position? Can I simply just gently push or pull on the valve rod? Ok, I will follow your suggestions tomorrow morning and let you all know what I find. Oh, and while I am at it, when I type my post and or reply, I space it out so it is easier to read, as yours is... but when I post it, it removes all my editing and leaves it looking like one long run on paragraph. What is the trick you used in writing your reply?

Hey, you will have to use jumpers to get the feedback voltages from the actuators. I usually take a short length of bare wire to insert in the female socket side to attach a jumper to. Makes it easy to use multiple jumpers, one jumping between controller and actuator and the other to the DVM. You should still be able to see the voltages even if your machine throws the ACS code. I assume it happens on start up?

RE: spool valves returning to center. With the actuator removed push in on the spool rod where the actuator attaches. There are springs on the rear (engine) side that will center the spools. They should move back to center as soon as you take pressure off the end. And, you did answer your question that the spools will be in the centered (neutral) position when the actuators are off.

Re: swapping actuators, you mentioned in your first post that you removed the lower actuator. That is the actuator for lift but you had a 32-34 error which would be the error for the tilt actuator or the upper actuator. Just wanted to make sure you knew that the lower was lift and the upper is tilt. I am recalling that from memory so if I got wrong, ignore what I said. Swapping the plugs should give the same basic information. Slightly cleaner check if you actually move them. If the error code doesn't change after you move them I would put the newest actuator on the bottom. It's not bad replacing the upper actuator through the access panel with the control panel in place if you have to do it sometime. Of course, you have a track machine so you might not have good access through the side. I haven't worked on a track machine.

Re: manual calibration, when you perform the manual calibration can you hear the actuators cycling? Seems like the manual calibration should at least get you going but not the same as having them calibrated by the dealer.

Re: formatting, I think the editor we type our messages into is expecting you to use the HTML editor that is available when you edit your profile. I haven't been able to get that HTML editor to work for me. I type in a couple of HTML breaks after my paragraphs, e.g. "&ltbr/&gt". But have to basically cut and paste the text into that editor after hitting "preview" and then "back to edit" mode. It's screwy and maybe some else has an idea. I am also using a Mac.

Will be interested to hear about what you discover. Hope it works out.

 

[BC873G]

Hey, you will have to use jumpers to get the feedback voltages from the actuators. I usually take a short length of bare wire to insert in the female socket side to attach a jumper to. Makes it easy to use multiple jumpers, one jumping between controller and actuator and the other to the DVM. You should still be able to see the voltages even if your machine throws the ACS code. I assume it happens on start up?

RE: spool valves returning to center. With the actuator removed push in on the spool rod where the actuator attaches. There are springs on the rear (engine) side that will center the spools. They should move back to center as soon as you take pressure off the end. And, you did answer your question that the spools will be in the centered (neutral) position when the actuators are off.

Re: swapping actuators, you mentioned in your first post that you removed the lower actuator. That is the actuator for lift but you had a 32-34 error which would be the error for the tilt actuator or the upper actuator. Just wanted to make sure you knew that the lower was lift and the upper is tilt. I am recalling that from memory so if I got wrong, ignore what I said. Swapping the plugs should give the same basic information. Slightly cleaner check if you actually move them. If the error code doesn't change after you move them I would put the newest actuator on the bottom. It's not bad replacing the upper actuator through the access panel with the control panel in place if you have to do it sometime. Of course, you have a track machine so you might not have good access through the side. I haven't worked on a track machine.

Re: manual calibration, when you perform the manual calibration can you hear the actuators cycling? Seems like the manual calibration should at least get you going but not the same as having them calibrated by the dealer.

Re: formatting, I think the editor we type our messages into is expecting you to use the HTML editor that is available when you edit your profile. I haven't been able to get that HTML editor to work for me. I type in a couple of HTML breaks after my paragraphs, e.g. "&ltbr/&gt". But have to basically cut and paste the text into that editor after hitting "preview" and then "back to edit" mode. It's screwy and maybe some else has an idea. I am also using a Mac.

Will be interested to hear about what you discover. Hope it works out.

I don't have the handles that lock on my machine so can't help you out there. I assume the manual calibration says something like hold the handles inward and then power on the machine, etc. If that is the case, use a bungee cord to hold the handles in after you release them with them a screw driver. Worth a try anyway. You should be able to hear actuators cycle as they go through their calibration test if it is working like it is supposed to.

Do you have a yellow float button on your left handle? If so, you might not have detents on the rear side of your spool valves (lift) for float. The yellow float button is electronic float handled by the controller. At least it is for the AHC controller.

 

[thedassler]

I don't have the handles that lock on my machine so can't help you out there. I assume the manual calibration says something like hold the handles inward and then power on the machine, etc. If that is the case, use a bungee cord to hold the handles in after you release them with them a screw driver. Worth a try anyway. You should be able to hear actuators cycle as they go through their calibration test if it is working like it is supposed to.

Do you have a yellow float button on your left handle? If so, you might not have detents on the rear side of your spool valves (lift) for float. The yellow float button is electronic float handled by the controller. At least it is for the AHC controller.

Hi All, I only had a few hours in the shop today but I will list the progress. First, start the wood stove. It is well above freezing, but feels ass cold. I guess the golden autumn here is Germany is over. Second I started up the t190 to let it warm up (recommended procedure in the shop manual prior to calibration test). Next I proceeded to attempt the manual calibration that is described in the service manual that included the serial number of my machine (531711788). Which describes first clearing any fault codes (not done as I cannot find any procedure to do so). At which point... 1) Lower seat bar. 2) Turn key to "run" position without starting motor. 3) Press green operation button to release hand controls (at this point I tried to "trick" the machine by gently releasing the solenoids to free up the hand controls). 4) Stroke the controls toward centre and hold. 5) Raise seat bar enough to engage BICS. 6) Lower seat bar. 7) Press green operation button as which time Calibration sequence should begin. No love...ACS light remains on, and at the end of the procedure at which time I should be hearing the Actuator motors "calibrating", I hear nothing. So... I pulled the steering panel and proceeded to follow some leads posted yesterday by BC783G and 7LBSSMALLIE. First I checked for 5v from the controller (female connector for both actuators) with key in the run position, and this checked out OK. I then checked the voltage output with the actuators installed and in the (assumed) neutral position. This reads as .66-.67 volts on both. Can anyone verify if this is correct? From a helpful youtube video, my understanding is that when the latter style actuators are in the neutral position (slide arm flush with end of aluminium housing) the voltage output should be 1.72 volts. Can anyone maybe confirm this, and if it should remain 1.72volts when installed and machine not in operation? In any case, I decided to pull both actuators and do a follow-up bench test. Prior to preforming a further bench test, I checked the spool valves. First, both are clean and dry and when gently pressed in, spring back firmly. When gently pulled out, they too spring back inward and do not appear to have any sloppy movement. It could be my imagination, but it did seem to me that the upper (tilt) spool valve did not have the same travel as the lower (lift) spool valve. It would make some sense as the lift and tilt cylinders are not the same size. But before I check the spool valves off my list, can anyone confirm if it is possible that the throw from the two spool valves could be different? They do use two different length screws for fastening the Actuators, but that in not conclusive either. Any thoughts or related experience would be great. OK, now bench test 2.0 of the actuators. Tilt actuator (2007 and likely original) with slide arm flush with end of housing, and with 5.0 v input, read 1.67 volts. I then disassembled to re-calibrate to 1.72 volts. Actuator operates smoothly and is easy to push in and out slide arm with fingers. I then for comparison removed connecting gear and the 12volt motor spins freely and smoothly with fingers. Lift actuator (2015) with slide arm flush with end of housing and 5.0 v input read 1.72 volts. However, actuator feels much stiffer than tilt actuator. I can push the slide arm in and pull it out, but it requires more effort. I then disassembled for comparison. With connecting gear removed, slide arm assembly runs in and out more freely. 12volt motor does not spin as freely as tilt actuator motor, and feels lumpy by comparison. The older tilt motor is and American made "Globe" motor with 4 mounting screws to the aluminium housing, while the newer motor is nondescript and has only 3 mounting screws and appears not to be of the same quality. Any thoughts or experience out there? I will add that both actuators operate in both direction with 5volt applied for test purposes. However I have no way to test speed or strength of motors. Could it be that the lift actuator is actually preforming outside of range and that throws a code and prevents proper calibration? Prior to todays removing of the actuators, I was only consistently getting first a 32-34 code (Tilt actuator not calibrated) which after attempting a manual calibration switched to 32-39 (lift actuator not calibrated). I did manage to get the to codes to switch back and forth more than once, but at this point (prior to pulling everything apart) I have been sitting with a 32-39 code. I ran out of time for any further testing today, but if anyone can help answer my questions or has any ideas they are willing to share, Please shout out!! Thanks for taking the time.

 

[BC873G]

Hi All, I only had a few hours in the shop today but I will list the progress. First, start the wood stove. It is well above freezing, but feels ass cold. I guess the golden autumn here is Germany is over. Second I started up the t190 to let it warm up (recommended procedure in the shop manual prior to calibration test). Next I proceeded to attempt the manual calibration that is described in the service manual that included the serial number of my machine (531711788). Which describes first clearing any fault codes (not done as I cannot find any procedure to do so). At which point... 1) Lower seat bar. 2) Turn key to "run" position without starting motor. 3) Press green operation button to release hand controls (at this point I tried to "trick" the machine by gently releasing the solenoids to free up the hand controls). 4) Stroke the controls toward centre and hold. 5) Raise seat bar enough to engage BICS. 6) Lower seat bar. 7) Press green operation button as which time Calibration sequence should begin. No love...ACS light remains on, and at the end of the procedure at which time I should be hearing the Actuator motors "calibrating", I hear nothing. So... I pulled the steering panel and proceeded to follow some leads posted yesterday by BC783G and 7LBSSMALLIE. First I checked for 5v from the controller (female connector for both actuators) with key in the run position, and this checked out OK. I then checked the voltage output with the actuators installed and in the (assumed) neutral position. This reads as .66-.67 volts on both. Can anyone verify if this is correct? From a helpful youtube video, my understanding is that when the latter style actuators are in the neutral position (slide arm flush with end of aluminium housing) the voltage output should be 1.72 volts. Can anyone maybe confirm this, and if it should remain 1.72volts when installed and machine not in operation? In any case, I decided to pull both actuators and do a follow-up bench test. Prior to preforming a further bench test, I checked the spool valves. First, both are clean and dry and when gently pressed in, spring back firmly. When gently pulled out, they too spring back inward and do not appear to have any sloppy movement. It could be my imagination, but it did seem to me that the upper (tilt) spool valve did not have the same travel as the lower (lift) spool valve. It would make some sense as the lift and tilt cylinders are not the same size. But before I check the spool valves off my list, can anyone confirm if it is possible that the throw from the two spool valves could be different? They do use two different length screws for fastening the Actuators, but that in not conclusive either. Any thoughts or related experience would be great. OK, now bench test 2.0 of the actuators. Tilt actuator (2007 and likely original) with slide arm flush with end of housing, and with 5.0 v input, read 1.67 volts. I then disassembled to re-calibrate to 1.72 volts. Actuator operates smoothly and is easy to push in and out slide arm with fingers. I then for comparison removed connecting gear and the 12volt motor spins freely and smoothly with fingers. Lift actuator (2015) with slide arm flush with end of housing and 5.0 v input read 1.72 volts. However, actuator feels much stiffer than tilt actuator. I can push the slide arm in and pull it out, but it requires more effort. I then disassembled for comparison. With connecting gear removed, slide arm assembly runs in and out more freely. 12volt motor does not spin as freely as tilt actuator motor, and feels lumpy by comparison. The older tilt motor is and American made "Globe" motor with 4 mounting screws to the aluminium housing, while the newer motor is nondescript and has only 3 mounting screws and appears not to be of the same quality. Any thoughts or experience out there? I will add that both actuators operate in both direction with 5volt applied for test purposes. However I have no way to test speed or strength of motors. Could it be that the lift actuator is actually preforming outside of range and that throws a code and prevents proper calibration? Prior to todays removing of the actuators, I was only consistently getting first a 32-34 code (Tilt actuator not calibrated) which after attempting a manual calibration switched to 32-39 (lift actuator not calibrated). I did manage to get the to codes to switch back and forth more than once, but at this point (prior to pulling everything apart) I have been sitting with a 32-39 code. I ran out of time for any further testing today, but if anyone can help answer my questions or has any ideas they are willing to share, Please shout out!! Thanks for taking the time.

Looks like you will have to do the calibration based what you are reading while the actuator is attached to the spool rod. If you are reading .66V then that is a problem. Mine read 1.72V while attached to the spool rods. What model actuator do you have? I have seen that new actuators are not calibrated flush but .114" into the end. That was referencing part number 7104842. I think these are the actuators for older machines with the metal AHC controllers. Regardless, I would try doing the calibration taking feedback readings while on the machine. You'll know which way to move the POT based on your understanding of the bench tests. It will be trail and error.

Your connector does have 5 wires? 2 for +-12v to the motor and 3 for POT in the actuator (2 for the 5V and 1 for feedback).

 

[thedassler]

Looks like you will have to do the calibration based what you are reading while the actuator is attached to the spool rod. If you are reading .66V then that is a problem. Mine read 1.72V while attached to the spool rods. What model actuator do you have? I have seen that new actuators are not calibrated flush but .114" into the end. That was referencing part number 7104842. I think these are the actuators for older machines with the metal AHC controllers. Regardless, I would try doing the calibration taking feedback readings while on the machine. You'll know which way to move the POT based on your understanding of the bench tests. It will be trail and error.

Your connector does have 5 wires? 2 for +-12v to the motor and 3 for POT in the actuator (2 for the 5V and 1 for feedback).

Hi BC873G, Thanks for confirming the voltage reading!! Although it seems like it will be a game of "twister" trying to calibrate on the machine, I think it is sound advice and it will take a lot of guessing out of the total situation. I will start off tomorrow by re-assembling the two actuators and then set them back in the machine and calibrate for 1.72 while in the machine. Any thoughts about my motor comment? As I said, I am not sure about the motor in the newest actuator, but as it is literally if not technically functioning, I am all for giving it a try...just thought you might have some additional thoughts. And yes my connector has 5 wires 2 for +-12v to the motor and 3 for POT in the actuator (2 for the 5V and 1 for feedback). Thanks again!!!

 

[BC873G]

Hi BC873G, Thanks for confirming the voltage reading!! Although it seems like it will be a game of "twister" trying to calibrate on the machine, I think it is sound advice and it will take a lot of guessing out of the total situation. I will start off tomorrow by re-assembling the two actuators and then set them back in the machine and calibrate for 1.72 while in the machine. Any thoughts about my motor comment? As I said, I am not sure about the motor in the newest actuator, but as it is literally if not technically functioning, I am all for giving it a try...just thought you might have some additional thoughts. And yes my connector has 5 wires 2 for +-12v to the motor and 3 for POT in the actuator (2 for the 5V and 1 for feedback). Thanks again!!!

Hey, I don't have any thoughts about the change in motors. However, even if the actuator rod feels stiff or not as smooth as the other I would still use it until it doesn't work at all. I still have one of my original actuators from a 2000 machine for my tilt. It seems a bit slow but is still working fine. I picked up a spare and ironically found it on eBay in Germany. It was brand new and I bench tested it and used on my 873 for a bit and then put the old one back on.

I've had some issues with the pins and sockets moving in the Metri Pack connectors and making bad connections. Make sure the last thing you do is push all the pins and sockets as far forward on those connectors when are done. There should be a rubber seal that you can push on to make sure they lock and move all the way forward in the connectors. That's assuming the 2006 models are still using them.

 

[thedassler]

Hey, I don't have any thoughts about the change in motors. However, even if the actuator rod feels stiff or not as smooth as the other I would still use it until it doesn't work at all. I still have one of my original actuators from a 2000 machine for my tilt. It seems a bit slow but is still working fine. I picked up a spare and ironically found it on eBay in Germany. It was brand new and I bench tested it and used on my 873 for a bit and then put the old one back on.

I've had some issues with the pins and sockets moving in the Metri Pack connectors and making bad connections. Make sure the last thing you do is push all the pins and sockets as far forward on those connectors when are done. There should be a rubber seal that you can push on to make sure they lock and move all the way forward in the connectors. That's assuming the 2006 models are still using them.

I fought the bobcat and the bobcat won... It is official, I am out of ideas. I have calibrated the actuators while in the machine. Now it is sending a code 32-34 (tilt actuator not calibrated). It switches from 32-34 to 32-39 (lift actuator not calibrated) intermittently after I have attempted to calibrate or preform one of the mysterious but seemingly useless manual calibration sequences) I get no other codes, and can not fully preform the manual calibration sequence as the processor senses that machine is out of calibrations and then sets the ACS light on thus making the sequence impossible to preform due to locked out controls.
I appreciate all the safety features to both protect the user and the machine, but I find this series of redundancy stupid. I am in Germany, although expensive, and a pain, I at least CAN find a way to have the machine serviced by a dealer. What about the poor folks in say Spain where the landmass is pretty big and I am guessing they have even less dealers than I have available to me!?
The only new news it that as previously when I set the actuators to 1.72 volts out of the machine and then measured them in the machine (0.66-.67) I could hear the actuators running in and out after I turned the key to the run position. Now, I only hear a slight noise, but certainly not full scroll on the actuators. I suppose it is possible that despite multiple attempts they are still not sitting fully at 1.72 volts but is some cases I was only able to set it to 1.73 due to the jump in voltage when trying to move from one to the next tooth on the position sensor.
Thanks for BC873G for your help and to Tazza and 7lbssmallie for trying to give support and ideas.

 

[BC873G]

I fought the bobcat and the bobcat won... It is official, I am out of ideas. I have calibrated the actuators while in the machine. Now it is sending a code 32-34 (tilt actuator not calibrated). It switches from 32-34 to 32-39 (lift actuator not calibrated) intermittently after I have attempted to calibrate or preform one of the mysterious but seemingly useless manual calibration sequences) I get no other codes, and can not fully preform the manual calibration sequence as the processor senses that machine is out of calibrations and then sets the ACS light on thus making the sequence impossible to preform due to locked out controls.
I appreciate all the safety features to both protect the user and the machine, but I find this series of redundancy stupid. I am in Germany, although expensive, and a pain, I at least CAN find a way to have the machine serviced by a dealer. What about the poor folks in say Spain where the landmass is pretty big and I am guessing they have even less dealers than I have available to me!?
The only new news it that as previously when I set the actuators to 1.72 volts out of the machine and then measured them in the machine (0.66-.67) I could hear the actuators running in and out after I turned the key to the run position. Now, I only hear a slight noise, but certainly not full scroll on the actuators. I suppose it is possible that despite multiple attempts they are still not sitting fully at 1.72 volts but is some cases I was only able to set it to 1.73 due to the jump in voltage when trying to move from one to the next tooth on the position sensor.
Thanks for BC873G for your help and to Tazza and 7lbssmallie for trying to give support and ideas.

I think the controller does a calibration each time on startup and you heard more actuator noise when they were at .66 volts because it was taking longer to try to calibrate. The 1.73V shouldn't be an issue. There should be a range that is acceptable.

With any luck at all they can just do the calibration with the computer and get you going. Seems like you could have a bad actuator. You said that this is a new machine to you. How many hours did you put on it before it started to act up?

Let us know when you get it back what the resolution was. Good luck.

 

[thedassler]

I think the controller does a calibration each time on startup and you heard more actuator noise when they were at .66 volts because it was taking longer to try to calibrate. The 1.73V shouldn't be an issue. There should be a range that is acceptable.

With any luck at all they can just do the calibration with the computer and get you going. Seems like you could have a bad actuator. You said that this is a new machine to you. How many hours did you put on it before it started to act up?

Let us know when you get it back what the resolution was. Good luck.

I agree, the actuator noise I heard when considerably out of spec at .66 volts was likely the actuators looking for neutral. And I agree that now that they are nearly there, that could be why they remain almost silent (a very short "grunt"). However, I don't think that the actuators are calibrating, I think they are simply looking for neutral or what the controller believes to be neutral. And when it doesn't find what it is looking for, it throws a code.

OK, follow my thinking. First, Bobcat says that the machine needs to be updated and or calibrated when nearly anything is done involving the ACS. And as many have posted in the forum, the ACS system in picky and often needs a hook up to at a dealer to solve pesky problems like mine.

Now assuming that all actuators are set at factory they should always be within 0.01 or maybe 0.05 of the 1.72 volt target at neutral. Technically there is nothing to set on the actuator it is purely mechanical. So what are we calibrating or setting? The controller... So when the dealer hooks up our bobcats to the service PC for calibrations, First they run a test to verify that the actuators are preforming within spec. Measuring run time and time back to neutral ECT. Then assuming that the actuators are deemed OK, which also includes based on the results, the health of the spool valves, it tells the controller to except whatever voltage is present when the actuators are installed and "OK." In some cases, simply do to variations within machine parts tolerances, or within the preset actuator, that means one actuator might read 2.02 volts and the other 1.67 volts at "neutral" while in the machine.

Now the controller is looking for those values when the key in set to run or pre start, and if the values sent back to the controller are out of what is an allowable range (lets say .05 volts) it throws a code.

Looking back at my situation, my first code was a double code. 32-34 (tilt actuator not in neutral) and 32-65 (sensor supply voltage out of range). Truth be told, knowing what I believe I know now, I should have just cleaned the terminals and attempted a manual calibration. Actually I did try that, but was impatient and probably should have let the cleaned terminals dry overnight after spraying them with break cleaner. The 32-65 code is what makes me think it might have been that simple. Instead I dismantled my actuator and learned the hard way about resetting the return values to 1.72 volts when in neutral. All of which I found in a youtube video before joining this forum which was a result of a google search for "bobcat code 32-34".

Tiny side note...I actually took out and dismantled the wrong actuator first. For some reason I got confused and played with the lift actuator, and when I put it back in, and tried a manual calibration, it switched to 32-39 (lift actuator not in neutral) which is the one I just messed with. And the 32-65 (sensor supply voltage out of range) was possibly still from my unresolved dirty connection on the tilt actuator. And before realising my mistake, I took out the other (tilt) actuator and dismantled it too.

I won't bore anyone with the next hundred steps in the learning curve, some of that you can read above. However, for shits and giggles, I believe that at this point my machine thinks I have two new actuators because the values returned to the controller don't match what the controller is looking for (because I reset them when I manually bench set the values, and later manually set the values in the machine).

At the moment I only have one code. 32-34 (tilt actuator not in neutral) which also according to the 900 page dealer shop manual, also reads "tilt actuator not calibrated". The question now is, if my theory is correct, can I slowly reset the tilt actuator voltage output higher or lower by moving the regulator wheel one tooth at a time, and maybe get lucky and find the range my controller is looking for?

Note: The shop manual states that upon powering up, the ACS processor runs a system check in order starting with the lift handle sensor and then the lift actuator before moving on to the tilt handle sensor and then tilt actuator. Does that mean that if the lift actuator is not throwing a code, that it is within range?

Got to get back to my regular work tomorrow, and I might just wimp out and hall this heavy paperweight to the dealer, but it is food for thought.

What is the lesson here? Assuming my theories are right, and regardless of what one might think is wrong, I would advise hooking up the actuator to a volt meter to get a reading from the actuators while in the machine prior to removing. At least then you will know what return values or volts your controller is looking for, and it might just save you a trip to the dealer.

Lastly, Thanks again to BC873G, so far nearly all of your thoughts have put me further down the road to figuring this little female dog...I mean cat... out, and to answer your question as to how long have I had the machine, I only had about 2 hours of light work on the machine before I started this mess with a full service. It was operating fine but as I had no history I thought it best to "start new" with all the fluids and so on.

 

[BC873G]

I agree, the actuator noise I heard when considerably out of spec at .66 volts was likely the actuators looking for neutral. And I agree that now that they are nearly there, that could be why they remain almost silent (a very short "grunt"). However, I don't think that the actuators are calibrating, I think they are simply looking for neutral or what the controller believes to be neutral. And when it doesn't find what it is looking for, it throws a code.

OK, follow my thinking. First, Bobcat says that the machine needs to be updated and or calibrated when nearly anything is done involving the ACS. And as many have posted in the forum, the ACS system in picky and often needs a hook up to at a dealer to solve pesky problems like mine.

Now assuming that all actuators are set at factory they should always be within 0.01 or maybe 0.05 of the 1.72 volt target at neutral. Technically there is nothing to set on the actuator it is purely mechanical. So what are we calibrating or setting? The controller... So when the dealer hooks up our bobcats to the service PC for calibrations, First they run a test to verify that the actuators are preforming within spec. Measuring run time and time back to neutral ECT. Then assuming that the actuators are deemed OK, which also includes based on the results, the health of the spool valves, it tells the controller to except whatever voltage is present when the actuators are installed and "OK." In some cases, simply do to variations within machine parts tolerances, or within the preset actuator, that means one actuator might read 2.02 volts and the other 1.67 volts at "neutral" while in the machine.

Now the controller is looking for those values when the key in set to run or pre start, and if the values sent back to the controller are out of what is an allowable range (lets say .05 volts) it throws a code.

Looking back at my situation, my first code was a double code. 32-34 (tilt actuator not in neutral) and 32-65 (sensor supply voltage out of range). Truth be told, knowing what I believe I know now, I should have just cleaned the terminals and attempted a manual calibration. Actually I did try that, but was impatient and probably should have let the cleaned terminals dry overnight after spraying them with break cleaner. The 32-65 code is what makes me think it might have been that simple. Instead I dismantled my actuator and learned the hard way about resetting the return values to 1.72 volts when in neutral. All of which I found in a youtube video before joining this forum which was a result of a google search for "bobcat code 32-34".

Tiny side note...I actually took out and dismantled the wrong actuator first. For some reason I got confused and played with the lift actuator, and when I put it back in, and tried a manual calibration, it switched to 32-39 (lift actuator not in neutral) which is the one I just messed with. And the 32-65 (sensor supply voltage out of range) was possibly still from my unresolved dirty connection on the tilt actuator. And before realising my mistake, I took out the other (tilt) actuator and dismantled it too.

I won't bore anyone with the next hundred steps in the learning curve, some of that you can read above. However, for shits and giggles, I believe that at this point my machine thinks I have two new actuators because the values returned to the controller don't match what the controller is looking for (because I reset them when I manually bench set the values, and later manually set the values in the machine).

At the moment I only have one code. 32-34 (tilt actuator not in neutral) which also according to the 900 page dealer shop manual, also reads "tilt actuator not calibrated". The question now is, if my theory is correct, can I slowly reset the tilt actuator voltage output higher or lower by moving the regulator wheel one tooth at a time, and maybe get lucky and find the range my controller is looking for?

Note: The shop manual states that upon powering up, the ACS processor runs a system check in order starting with the lift handle sensor and then the lift actuator before moving on to the tilt handle sensor and then tilt actuator. Does that mean that if the lift actuator is not throwing a code, that it is within range?

Got to get back to my regular work tomorrow, and I might just wimp out and hall this heavy paperweight to the dealer, but it is food for thought.

What is the lesson here? Assuming my theories are right, and regardless of what one might think is wrong, I would advise hooking up the actuator to a volt meter to get a reading from the actuators while in the machine prior to removing. At least then you will know what return values or volts your controller is looking for, and it might just save you a trip to the dealer.

Lastly, Thanks again to BC873G, so far nearly all of your thoughts have put me further down the road to figuring this little female dog...I mean cat... out, and to answer your question as to how long have I had the machine, I only had about 2 hours of light work on the machine before I started this mess with a full service. It was operating fine but as I had no history I thought it best to "start new" with all the fluids and so on.

I think you have learned a few lessons the hard way. It happens. I can provide some more information on other tests. If you are comfortable posting an email address I will forward.

Looking through my reference material I would try using 2.0 volts for your actuator neutral voltages and see what happens. If you have Hall Effects handles then 2.0V is what you might need. Also, that 32-65 is a fault for the supply voltage coming from your handle sensors so there might be an issue further up the chain. Do you have a float button on your left handle?

 

[7LBSSMALLIE]

I think you have learned a few lessons the hard way. It happens. I can provide some more information on other tests. If you are comfortable posting an email address I will forward.

Looking through my reference material I would try using 2.0 volts for your actuator neutral voltages and see what happens. If you have Hall Effects handles then 2.0V is what you might need. Also, that 32-65 is a fault for the supply voltage coming from your handle sensors so there might be an issue further up the chain. Do you have a float button on your left handle?

never thought id say this but too much info. cant follow thread. lets break it down. 32-34 code. PROBLEM, no lift or tilt. yes ? if so we need to detirmene if problem is electrical or mecanicail., to do this we swap connectors does code change. if yes electric if not mechanical.

 

[7LBSSMALLIE]

never thought id say this but too much info. cant follow thread. lets break it down. 32-34 code. PROBLEM, no lift or tilt. yes ? if so we need to detirmene if problem is electrical or mecanicail., to do this we swap connectors does code change. if yes electric if not mechanical.

OK no lift or tilt. active 32-34 code. swap connectors does code change?(easy breezy)