wiring problems cont....

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610Bobcat

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Apr 6, 2005
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let me explain what happened. I had a wiring meltdown from the instrament panel all the way to the alternator. so I need a simple way to re-wire it to make the charging system function. What I need to know is how to wire the ignition switch, to the guage, then back to the alernator, including the regulator. It's not functioning. It won't keep the battery charged. It's a big mess and I can't seem to figure out how to get it all wired back together correctly. So if anyone has any Diagrams or any advice PLEASE let me know as soon as you can. Thanks in advance -Joe
 

500K_773

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Mar 5, 2004
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Thanks for explaining your problem. Most wiring diagrams are too large to scan on a normal sized scanner. If you could can them on a larger scanner, the resulting file would be too big to e-mail, especially over a dial-up connection. I may be worth you while to invest in a service manual for your machine if they are still available through your dealer. Should only be about $40-$60.
I'm not certain, but on most charging systems, the battery is charged directly from the alternator / regulator. The harness to the instument panel should not be carrying the charging current. You may want to remove the alternator from the machine and have it tested at an electric rebuilder or auto parts store. The regualtor may have been damaged in the original short.
The wires to the instument panel should only provide power to the instuments. Does your instrument panel have a voltmeter or an amp meter? This should only be a gauge of what the system is doing and not a conduit for the charging system to the battery. Have you taken any reading directly off the alternator with an voltmeter?
 

Tazza

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Thanks for explaining your problem. Most wiring diagrams are too large to scan on a normal sized scanner. If you could can them on a larger scanner, the resulting file would be too big to e-mail, especially over a dial-up connection. I may be worth you while to invest in a service manual for your machine if they are still available through your dealer. Should only be about $40-$60.
I'm not certain, but on most charging systems, the battery is charged directly from the alternator / regulator. The harness to the instument panel should not be carrying the charging current. You may want to remove the alternator from the machine and have it tested at an electric rebuilder or auto parts store. The regualtor may have been damaged in the original short.
The wires to the instument panel should only provide power to the instuments. Does your instrument panel have a voltmeter or an amp meter? This should only be a gauge of what the system is doing and not a conduit for the charging system to the battery. Have you taken any reading directly off the alternator with an voltmeter?
It may be an idea to check out the alternator, as there must have been a reason the wires burnt out. I will forward you a very simple circuit that you can build to test out if the alternator is still workig. It is simply a light bulb and a diode, list like the circuit used in a car to show when the charging system is not working. If it is working you simply find a wire in the harness that is live when the key is in the on position and off when the switch is off. If you really need to, you can run a wire from the battery directally to the alternator, i think it is labeled B but i am not sure on this. This will energise the rotor and if the alternator is still working it will charge the battery, BUT if you leave this connected when not in use it will flatten the battery. Just use this to test it, as it will make your carbon brushes wear out faster. I have to run off to work now, i will do my best to draw up that diagram for you when i get home.
 

610Bobcat

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Apr 6, 2005
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It may be an idea to check out the alternator, as there must have been a reason the wires burnt out. I will forward you a very simple circuit that you can build to test out if the alternator is still workig. It is simply a light bulb and a diode, list like the circuit used in a car to show when the charging system is not working. If it is working you simply find a wire in the harness that is live when the key is in the on position and off when the switch is off. If you really need to, you can run a wire from the battery directally to the alternator, i think it is labeled B but i am not sure on this. This will energise the rotor and if the alternator is still working it will charge the battery, BUT if you leave this connected when not in use it will flatten the battery. Just use this to test it, as it will make your carbon brushes wear out faster. I have to run off to work now, i will do my best to draw up that diagram for you when i get home.
I PUT ON A DIFFERENT ALTERNATOR, BUT IT DIDNT SEEM TO MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. WHEN I GO TO START THE 610, THE VOLT GAUGE SHOWS A DISCHARGE WHICH IS EXPECTED UNTIL IT STARTS, THEN SHOW A POSITIVE CHARGE. BUT IT DOESNT, IT STAYS AT "0" AND WHEN I LIFT THE POSITIVE CABLE OFF THE BATTERY THE MOTOR DIES. WHICH USE TO BE A GOOD OLD WAY TO SEE IF IT IS CHARGING OR NOT! I USED MY VOLT METER ON THE ALTERNATOR TO TEST WHAT IT WAS PUTTING OUT AND IT ONLY SHOWS ABOUT 12.5 VOLTS AND IT SHOULD BE PUTTING OUT 14 VOLTS. I WILL FOR SURE TRY YOUR TEST WIRE METHOD. I DO GREATLY APPRECIATE EVERYTHING YOU CAN HELP ME WITH AND LOOK FORWARD TO YOUR WIRING DIAGRAM.
 

Tazza

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I PUT ON A DIFFERENT ALTERNATOR, BUT IT DIDNT SEEM TO MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. WHEN I GO TO START THE 610, THE VOLT GAUGE SHOWS A DISCHARGE WHICH IS EXPECTED UNTIL IT STARTS, THEN SHOW A POSITIVE CHARGE. BUT IT DOESNT, IT STAYS AT "0" AND WHEN I LIFT THE POSITIVE CABLE OFF THE BATTERY THE MOTOR DIES. WHICH USE TO BE A GOOD OLD WAY TO SEE IF IT IS CHARGING OR NOT! I USED MY VOLT METER ON THE ALTERNATOR TO TEST WHAT IT WAS PUTTING OUT AND IT ONLY SHOWS ABOUT 12.5 VOLTS AND IT SHOULD BE PUTTING OUT 14 VOLTS. I WILL FOR SURE TRY YOUR TEST WIRE METHOD. I DO GREATLY APPRECIATE EVERYTHING YOU CAN HELP ME WITH AND LOOK FORWARD TO YOUR WIRING DIAGRAM.
Ok, i took a picture of the schmatic i used on my charging system. http://users.tpg.com.au/tazza_/117_1771.JPG It is a very simple circuit, it is simply a diode (such as a 1N4004 available from any electronics store) and a light in series. When the alternator is NOT charging the light will be illuminated, and when the alternator is working it will not be off. The light bulb you use isn't very importent, an old automotive indicator bulb would do the job (i used a panel mount low wattage bulb and mounted it into my instrument panel), even something with a lower wattage would also work. You will notice i included a picture of a diode in the picture, you must pay attention to the direction that is it facing, the white band must be connected to the alternator side. Attach where it has 15 to the + of your battery. You may need to rev the engine up a bit to get it to start working but this is normal. Please let me know how you go with this. Good luck!. Taryn
 

Tazza

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Ok, i took a picture of the schmatic i used on my charging system. http://users.tpg.com.au/tazza_/117_1771.JPG It is a very simple circuit, it is simply a diode (such as a 1N4004 available from any electronics store) and a light in series. When the alternator is NOT charging the light will be illuminated, and when the alternator is working it will not be off. The light bulb you use isn't very importent, an old automotive indicator bulb would do the job (i used a panel mount low wattage bulb and mounted it into my instrument panel), even something with a lower wattage would also work. You will notice i included a picture of a diode in the picture, you must pay attention to the direction that is it facing, the white band must be connected to the alternator side. Attach where it has 15 to the + of your battery. You may need to rev the engine up a bit to get it to start working but this is normal. Please let me know how you go with this. Good luck!. Taryn
I really should read what i type before i click send. *slaps forhead homer style D'OH* "When the alternator is working it will not be off." SHOULD have said "When the alternator is working it will be off." I hope that helps with any confusion
 

StuZ

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Nov 22, 2003
Messages
133
Ok, i took a picture of the schmatic i used on my charging system. http://users.tpg.com.au/tazza_/117_1771.JPG It is a very simple circuit, it is simply a diode (such as a 1N4004 available from any electronics store) and a light in series. When the alternator is NOT charging the light will be illuminated, and when the alternator is working it will not be off. The light bulb you use isn't very importent, an old automotive indicator bulb would do the job (i used a panel mount low wattage bulb and mounted it into my instrument panel), even something with a lower wattage would also work. You will notice i included a picture of a diode in the picture, you must pay attention to the direction that is it facing, the white band must be connected to the alternator side. Attach where it has 15 to the + of your battery. You may need to rev the engine up a bit to get it to start working but this is normal. Please let me know how you go with this. Good luck!. Taryn
If you are not wanting to rewire the system back to spec, try this idea. Install a small frame delco self exciting alternator, and a VOLT meter. Then, you will need 1 power wire from the starter to the "bat" terminal of the alt. and run another power wire to a fuse and then to the key switch and across to the VOLT meter. By doing this you will not need a regulator for it is built in the alt, (the reg is the self excite part) you won't need to rewire the AMPmeter, as an AMPmeter has current going thru it and a VOLT meter has current running to it only. Amp meters and the wires to AND from them carry the full system amps all the time, and where it stops, so does the charging. A volt meter, where it just checks system voltage, only has to have a power wire to it (not in a loop) and can get it's power from a fuse, key switch, or any power wire. Good Luck !!
 
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