Bobcat T590 Hub oil variants?!

[maxdub]

So my drive motor on my t590 started leaking fluid. Machine was a sunbelt rental and has 1940hrs on it now but bought it when it had about 1600 hrs. The hydraulic fluid started crossing over to the hub oil side and leaking out of the face seals. Took the drive motor off, tore it apart, hydraulic side of the motor was perfect. Hub oil and brake side was disgusting, fluid was basically all rust juice with grime and what not. Cleaned it all up as best I could and resealed it with new seal kit and reused the brake clutches. Reinstalled it and all is good, no leaks and brake works. Which leads me to the point of this post. We know that bobcat does not give us specifications on the weights of the fluid they use and price gouge the **** out of hub oil for 12oz and fear monger us into buying their fluids. Well, since I’m obviously working on the drive motor and one side has new brake hub oil, I, obviously as any other normal person should change the fluid on the opposite side as well, the side that “seems good” and has no leaks. You could say any other normal person would also check these fluids when they first bought the machine but I did not, I guess I’m a bit not normal. Anywho, I bought enough of the bobcat fluid for both sides and went to change the opposite side when, (you’ve probably already assumed) nothing came out. Nada, not even a drop. All I could see is caked up rust. I was thoroughly shocked that the seal separate the hydraulic fluid did not burn out. Now maybe the face seal will be leaking but as of this post I haven’t filled the hub yet. Which makes me question?? Do we even need hub oil in there? Jk jk ofcourse we do, but I’m just surprised that the drive motor hasn’t given me issues. So which leads me to the conclusion that everything would be perfectly fine with any regular good synthetic gear oil instead of the overpriced bobcat fluid. And taking it apart, I could also see there was really nothing to it, it’s just wet brake clutches suspended in 12oz of fluid to keep them lubricated, the main bearings are lubricated by the hydraulic fluid anyway. Now to clean this rust out? I was thinking to add 12oz of trans fluid since it’s a detergent. My only question is whether the seals will handle the trans fluid? What do yall think?

 

[foton]

I would guess that if it does not leak with something like dextron or mercon you should be good cause that stuff is thin as hydro oil gets, which should help when trying to wash things out. The only thing I see is using a oil that is friendly with the wet brakes.

 

[foton]

but it almost has to leak or there would be fluid in there as long as it was in there from the factory or then emptyed and not refilled.

 

[maxdub]

but it almost has to leak or there would be fluid in there as long as it was in there from the factory or then emptyed and not refilled.

Lol no leaks. Been running on atf for about a week and a half now. Cleaned it out nicely. Drained it and refilled it with some atf again to clean some more before putting in the actual stuff. There was obviously fluid in there from factory but it was probably never changed and it all either burned out or who knows. All I know is that I never drained it and most likely the last time there was any drop of fluid in there was probably at least 200hrs ago.

 

[foton]

you better go but a lottery ticket with that kinda luck.

 

[DesertRatliff]

Just bumping this thread to see if anyone knows of any hub oil variants for the T series Bobcats. I have a T450 that needs drive oil service, my dealer is a 140 miles round trip away and Bobcat on-line seems only willing to sell me quantities of 12 bottles of their proprietary oil. Honestly, I should have done more research before committing to a company who prices gouges their customers with non-identifiable consumables.

 

[foton]

you need to do some research on this but I wonder if a UTF oil would work ,one that is safe for hydro systems and is gear drive rated. the stuff is sold in 5 gal pails usally less than 100 bucks.

 

[maxdub]

Just bumping this thread to see if anyone knows of any hub oil variants for the T series Bobcats. I have a T450 that needs drive oil service, my dealer is a 140 miles round trip away and Bobcat on-line seems only willing to sell me quantities of 12 bottles of their proprietary oil. Honestly, I should have done more research before committing to a company who prices gouges their customers with non-identifiable consumables.

It’s the same fluid as in my case. There’s nothing to it except for the weight of the fluids. I think a 75w-80 oil might be too thick because the fluid between the brake packs acts not just as a lubricant but it is what actually works as the shear grip between the plates that functions as the brake. When the brake piston is applied inside the the hub it compresses the fluid between the metal plates and the shear strength of the compressed fluid between the plates is what stops the hub from rotating. I found this out because I had recently drained the atf fluid I had in there and decided to rotate the hub fill port to 3 o’clock and leave the drain open at 9 o’clock to let it vent as I’m filling it up, and without the fluid, the brake couldn’t keep the machine still even though the other side was working. It was trying to do a 360 on me. Btw I had to turn the fill hole back to 12/1 o’clock position because the level of the full 12.7oz was higher than the 3 o’clock position, so wasn’t able to fill it all up in one go.

 

[maxdub]

It’s the same fluid as in my case. There’s nothing to it except for the weight of the fluids. I think a 75w-80 oil might be too thick because the fluid between the brake packs acts not just as a lubricant but it is what actually works as the shear grip between the plates that functions as the brake. When the brake piston is applied inside the the hub it compresses the fluid between the metal plates and the shear strength of the compressed fluid between the plates is what stops the hub from rotating. I found this out because I had recently drained the atf fluid I had in there and decided to rotate the hub fill port to 3 o’clock and leave the drain open at 9 o’clock to let it vent as I’m filling it up, and without the fluid, the brake couldn’t keep the machine still even though the other side was working. It was trying to do a 360 on me. Btw I had to turn the fill hole back to 12/1 o’clock position because the level of the full 12.7oz was higher than the 3 o’clock position, so wasn’t able to fill it all up in one go.

Basically 75w-80 might be too thick and cause too much drag I feel like. The fluid they use is a bit thicker than atf but honestly not by much. I’m guessing it has high pressure properties which anyone could figure out by sending the oil for an analysis. I might do that actually.

 

[maxdub]

It’s the same fluid as in my case. There’s nothing to it except for the weight of the fluids. I think a 75w-80 oil might be too thick because the fluid between the brake packs acts not just as a lubricant but it is what actually works as the shear grip between the plates that functions as the brake. When the brake piston is applied inside the the hub it compresses the fluid between the metal plates and the shear strength of the compressed fluid between the plates is what stops the hub from rotating. I found this out because I had recently drained the atf fluid I had in there and decided to rotate the hub fill port to 3 o’clock and leave the drain open at 9 o’clock to let it vent as I’m filling it up, and without the fluid, the brake couldn’t keep the machine still even though the other side was working. It was trying to do a 360 on me. Btw I had to turn the fill hole back to 12/1 o’clock position because the level of the full 12.7oz was higher than the 3 o’clock position, so wasn’t able to fill it all up in one go.

Basically 75w-80 might be too thick and cause too much drag I feel like. The fluid they use is a bit thicker than atf but honestly not by much. I’m guessing it has high pressure properties which anyone could figure out by sending the oil for an analysis. I might do that actually.

 

[foton]

well that is another thing about utf it is safe to use with wet brakes.

 

[DesertRatliff]

That's all some good info. It's only 24oz of fluid I'd need to service both drive motors but I'm a bit frustrated I can't purchase that quantity through Bobcat's online portal and would need to make a day trip to head to the "local" Bobcat dealer. Always interested in alternative options, especially in cases where it's an emergency (Ie, a leaky seal and need the drive topped up and operational) and not just for scheduled service. If anyone finds a gear drive rated UTF that might be appropriate for this application, please post here. Thanks!

 

[DesertRatliff]

Thinking that the Bobcat North America online dealer portal selling the drive oil in nothing but quantities of 12 mustn't be correct, I emailed Bobcat. Here's the correspondence:

Hi Bobcat NA,

I have a 2015 T450 that needs to have the oil on both drive motors serviced. I'm looking to buy the consumables on your site and have them shipped but cannot order the (2) bottles I need. It says I can only order quantities of 12. Can you please advise. I do not need 12 bottles of your proprietary fluid, just 2.

Thank you,
N************

Hello N***********,
The 7270874 drive motor oil only available in quantities of 12.

Thank you,
The Bobcat Team

Thanks for the response but don't you think requiring me to buy 12 bottles of your proprietary, mysterious drive oil when I only need 2 is the most ridiculous thing you've heard all week? If Bobcat isn't going to disclose the formula to find an alternative elsewhere, at least make it available in the quantity customers need it. Sheesh!

Thanks but no thanks,
N*************

Hello N*************,
This issue has been brought up multiple times, but it has been decided to keep the order qty. in multiples of 12.

Thank you,
The Bobcat Team

 

[brdgbldr]

Thinking that the Bobcat North America online dealer portal selling the drive oil in nothing but quantities of 12 mustn't be correct, I emailed Bobcat. Here's the correspondence:

Hi Bobcat NA,

I have a 2015 T450 that needs to have the oil on both drive motors serviced. I'm looking to buy the consumables on your site and have them shipped but cannot order the (2) bottles I need. It says I can only order quantities of 12. Can you please advise. I do not need 12 bottles of your proprietary fluid, just 2.

Thank you,
N************

Hello N***********,
The 7270874 drive motor oil only available in quantities of 12.

Thank you,
The Bobcat Team

Thanks for the response but don't you think requiring me to buy 12 bottles of your proprietary, mysterious drive oil when I only need 2 is the most ridiculous thing you've heard all week? If Bobcat isn't going to disclose the formula to find an alternative elsewhere, at least make it available in the quantity customers need it. Sheesh!

Thanks but no thanks,
N*************

Hello N*************,
This issue has been brought up multiple times, but it has been decided to keep the order qty. in multiples of 12.

Thank you,
The Bobcat Team

Yeah, the Bobcat online ordering system requires you to order the quantities that they have pre-packaged. That goes for all sorts of items like o-rings, bolts etc.

They due however sell maintenance kits for different hours of service that have the proper quantities for that specific service. If you dig deeper you may find the quantity you need, however, you may get other maintenance items that you don’t need at the moment.

The other thing you can do is try calling up a rental shop that carries Bobcat and see what they use.

 

[DesertRatliff]

That all makes a bit more sense. Thanks for posting. There is a Bobcat rental place within a half hour of me. I'll give them a call and see if they have any ideas.

 

[DesertRatliff]

Just an FYI for anyone searching this topic in the future:

White Star Machinery out of Kansas has an online store that sells individually sized jugs of this for you Bobcat application.

I got (2) 12oz. containers of Bobcat's proprietary BS final drive fluid shipped to my door cheaper than my "local" Bobcat dealer + fuel to drive there and back.

https://shop.whitestarmachinery.com/?syclid=5953b5b1-d280-49a2-aa28-7b829958be6b