863 G Deutz fueling problems

[koko3052]

The problem started last fall, somewhat suddenly, when the weather turned colder. 2000 yr. vintage, 863 G about 5,000 hrs.. Prior to this it has always been an excellent cold starter down to about minus 30 C, unassisted. Starts & runs OK but continuous bluish smoke with very strong fuel smell. Here is a list of things done in order; - changed fuel filters- no help -replaced lift pump after messing around w/old one for a time- slightly helped -placed a fuel can on top of cab & plumbed fuel line directly to lift pump to eliminate possibility of bad fuel line- no help - removed air filters & ran engine to warm up- no help - removed turbo air inlet hose to check radial runout- no play * turbo seems to stop turning too quickly after shut down, but will confirm with an extra set of hands today! - right in the process of building a fitting to check engine compression thru the glow plug holes - will remove exhaust side of turbo piping today to see if blades may be touching the housing - haven't checked/cleaned PCV as yet but will - last thing that I can think of is to try to confirm injectors functioning properly by removing & cranking over engine. When checking the things that have not been done as yet , I will start engine just to try to find out what was causing the "smoking". If anyone has any other thoughts as to correction of my engines problem PLEASE let me know. BTW- called my local dealer/stealer for a cost on new turbo……$3500.00!! HAHAHAHAA! Everybody needs a good laugh to start the day! (

 

[antfarmer2]

PCV

 

[OldMachinist]

PCV

If the PCV is good I'd get busy with the compression check. Oil cooled engines will smoke if a bad head gasket lets the cooling oil into a cylinder. If a head gasket leak gets bad enough the engine may not shut down since it will suck enough oil thru the leak to keep it running until it runs out of oil.

 

[koko3052]

If the PCV is good I'd get busy with the compression check. Oil cooled engines will smoke if a bad head gasket lets the cooling oil into a cylinder. If a head gasket leak gets bad enough the engine may not shut down since it will suck enough oil thru the leak to keep it running until it runs out of oil.

Well, pulled the muffler & the PCV. Not much to it, just a light spring & diaphragm. Washed well & checked diaphragm by blowing compressed air into the outlet tube & no leaks. While I was right there, I checked & adjusted valve lash. Tomorrow pull the exhaust pipe off of the turbo & check that, then pull injectors & check spray pattern. The compression test yielded 385-395 psi! That's at the top end of spec & only 2.5% difference. Sure hope that I find a bad injector! Price quoted on the turbo is ridiculous!

 

[Tazza]

Well, pulled the muffler & the PCV. Not much to it, just a light spring & diaphragm. Washed well & checked diaphragm by blowing compressed air into the outlet tube & no leaks. While I was right there, I checked & adjusted valve lash. Tomorrow pull the exhaust pipe off of the turbo & check that, then pull injectors & check spray pattern. The compression test yielded 385-395 psi! That's at the top end of spec & only 2.5% difference. Sure hope that I find a bad injector! Price quoted on the turbo is ridiculous!

If it is found to be the turbo, don't go to the dealer, cheaper options are available if you look around. a Deutz dealer will be cheaper than bobcat.
Hopefully it's something simple and cheap, that is a crazy price for a turbo.

 

[koko3052]

If it is found to be the turbo, don't go to the dealer, cheaper options are available if you look around. a Deutz dealer will be cheaper than bobcat.
Hopefully it's something simple and cheap, that is a crazy price for a turbo.

Well my machine is running good now, but not really positive "what the fix" was…. leaning toward the PCV. I couldn't see anything wrong with the PCV, blew air into the outlet & the diaphragm pushed against the spring. Washed it with varsol & blew it dry. Took valve cover off & checked (adjusted slightly a couple of loose rockers), then washed the cover with varsol & blew dry but was careful not to get too agressive with the air gun around the PCV area. For a pump & injector test I pulled the injectors and reinstalled each to the same pump, & connected all lines. Hung a bunch of clear glass bottles over the injectors, pulled the fuel rack solenoid, connected a remote switch to starter & watched the spray pattern. All was good! Annealed the copper washers for the injectors & reinstalled. After I was done these two operations I started it up & it ran as it should….smoked for only a very short time. Now another problem has cropped up…. no power to the fuel rack solenoid! Must be a broken wire somewhere from lifting the cab as all fuses & relays & solenoid are good. Like they say "if it's got tires, tracks or tits…you're going to have trouble with it!"

 

[antfarmer2]

Well my machine is running good now, but not really positive "what the fix" was…. leaning toward the PCV. I couldn't see anything wrong with the PCV, blew air into the outlet & the diaphragm pushed against the spring. Washed it with varsol & blew it dry. Took valve cover off & checked (adjusted slightly a couple of loose rockers), then washed the cover with varsol & blew dry but was careful not to get too agressive with the air gun around the PCV area. For a pump & injector test I pulled the injectors and reinstalled each to the same pump, & connected all lines. Hung a bunch of clear glass bottles over the injectors, pulled the fuel rack solenoid, connected a remote switch to starter & watched the spray pattern. All was good! Annealed the copper washers for the injectors & reinstalled. After I was done these two operations I started it up & it ran as it should….smoked for only a very short time. Now another problem has cropped up…. no power to the fuel rack solenoid! Must be a broken wire somewhere from lifting the cab as all fuses & relays & solenoid are good. Like they say "if it's got tires, tracks or tits…you're going to have trouble with it!"

And cost you money lol glad you got it on my 743 when you lift the cab it will unplug a connector

 

[Tazza]

And cost you money lol glad you got it on my 743 when you lift the cab it will unplug a connector

Get a helper monkey to turn the ignition on for you and check for power to the fuel shut off solenoid. There are 3 pins on it i believe, one will be pull the other hold. They do burn out and are not cheap to replace, so start checking for power first. See if there is power with key on and power when cranking.
Good work on the mystery fix though.

 

[koko3052]

Get a helper monkey to turn the ignition on for you and check for power to the fuel shut off solenoid. There are 3 pins on it i believe, one will be pull the other hold. They do burn out and are not cheap to replace, so start checking for power first. See if there is power with key on and power when cranking.
Good work on the mystery fix though.

Thx Guys…. I HATE mystery fixes! My "monkey" is busy planting her garden right now , buy I will bother her for a few minutes tomorrow. I've already checked for power at the plug when Key is "on" & when running & nothing. There needs to be power there when the machine is running, but I'll grab my monkey & test for power on "start". All this did get me to know my machine better & find out that it is in fairly good condition.