843 Raised Up on its own!

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ajwgator

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Oct 12, 2005
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Hey guys, If you read my previous post on my 843 hyd leak problem you have to read this too! I left my machine over night and came back to it the next day, and the bucket tilt cylinder had extended completely on its own to the point that my machine was raised up and sitting on its ass end. Never seen that before. I tried to start it but for some reason it wouldn't start. Tried to get it back down by just moving the foot pedals without any hyd pressure but since the bucket was holding the machine up in the air and tip of it was straight in the ground, nothing could move. I am guessing its air in there but still can't figure out how it just did it on its' own without the engine running! I know you guys know what happened so let me in on it ok.
I tried jumping it after not being able to get it started and ended up getting the starter pretty damn hot. Now the starter doesn't seem to turn over fast enough to get it to take off even if I jump it with a running engine on my truck. I must have hurt the starter because I got it so hot. It is getting fuel ok, white smoke is coming out the exhaust as it tries to turn over. Its really odd because it started right up after I got the hose changed and lines back together as I said in my previous post.
This machine has a Perkins 200 engine but not sure what kind of starter it has yet. Anyone experienced anything like this before? Maybe the brushes are worn out and just a coincidence. Hope I haven't thrown the lead out of the armature! I should know better. I will pull it out in the morning and see what I can find. I would like to hear anyone else's experience with either of these problems though.
Thanks, Jay
 

sterlclan

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May 1, 2004
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528
yup air will do that was the fluid hot when you shut down?kinda odd that it wouldn't come down though it has something to do with expansion or contraction of fluid exactly how I don't know but Ive seen it before. as far as the starter brushes sound right check the cables too good luck. Jeff
 

Tazza

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Check your batteries charge, it may want a bit of a top up. I have had this before.
Now for the lifting, its totally normal if you lift the arms up and tilt the bucket as the back weighs more than the front when the arms are in the air. I have done this on a 731, lifted the arms up and tilted the bucket came back the next day and its front tyres were WAY up in the air. It will just be the fact the cylinders or spools have a bit of internal leakage that allows the cylinders to fall. Nothing to worry about.
Give your battery good charge then try to start it up again.
 

Tazza

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Check your batteries charge, it may want a bit of a top up. I have had this before.
Now for the lifting, its totally normal if you lift the arms up and tilt the bucket as the back weighs more than the front when the arms are in the air. I have done this on a 731, lifted the arms up and tilted the bucket came back the next day and its front tyres were WAY up in the air. It will just be the fact the cylinders or spools have a bit of internal leakage that allows the cylinders to fall. Nothing to worry about.
Give your battery good charge then try to start it up again.
ooh, and jump starting hardly ever works. To start a diesel you need lots of power. You just loose so much with jumper cables. Even starting a 3 cylinder with cables didn't work very well when i tried it.
 

ajwgator

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Oct 12, 2005
Messages
54
ooh, and jump starting hardly ever works. To start a diesel you need lots of power. You just loose so much with jumper cables. Even starting a 3 cylinder with cables didn't work very well when i tried it.
Thanks Jeff & Tazza, I did get my machine back down but had to lift up on the bucket with a tractor to get it back over center. I ended up loosening up the Bnuts on the tilt cylinder and let the weight of the machine retract it back. Air sure does some strange things in a hydralulic system, but I had never seen anything like that even in all my years as an aircraft hydraulic mechanic. Still not sure exactly how it caused the bucket to extend like that and raise the machine up so high. Looking at it more in depth, it had to pull the machine forward to get it up on the bucket front edge like it did. Enough of that.
After I got it back down, I did take the starter out and torn it down to see if I hurt it any. The brushes are fine, I emery clothed the armature where they contact the brushes, bearings seemed fine too. The only thing I wasn't able to check were the contacts inside the solenoid. Just couldn't get it apart. That is the only area left that might cause me to loose some of my electric power. If those contacts are pitted or burnt it won't let all of the battery power get to the starter motor. But I went ahead and put it back together and tried it again. I did get it started but it still seems to turn a bit slower than before this happened.
I did clean all the cables and battery posts too. The battery cable ends were a bit dark inside but I have seen a lot worse. I think I will be better off if I get a new solenoid to eliminate that possibility of a bad connection. I'm just really glad I didn't hurt the starter motor itself!
 
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