463 won't start

[david.ervin]

I've been tinkering with the machine for a few nights now, and just can't get my 463 to fire. For a week or so it had been starting great when completely cold, but hard to start warm, and lately won't start at all. So far, I've dumped the fuel and refilled, taken apart the water separator and bled the air out. I tried a shot of WD40 in the air intake in an effort to get it to fire up and suck out any remaining air, but that got me nowhere. I'm pretty sure the glow plugs are good, since I can hear the change in the fan speed and see the voltmeter change when I hit the button. I'd rather not resort to ether to get it to fire, and I see that as a temporary fix anyway. Where do I go next?

 

[antfarmer2]

Is the battery good and hot?

 

[david.ervin]

Is the battery good and hot?

The battery was good until I cranked and cranked without starting. I've got it hooked to jumper cables and a running truck for the work I'm doing now, so the engine spins over pretty quickly.

 

[antfarmer2]

The battery was good until I cranked and cranked without starting. I've got it hooked to jumper cables and a running truck for the work I'm doing now, so the engine spins over pretty quickly.

How cold is it?

 

[david.ervin]

How cold is it?

Ah, temperature hot, gotcha. It's about 35F out here right now. Joyous central Ohio weather.

 

[antfarmer2]

Ah, temperature hot, gotcha. It's about 35F out here right now. Joyous central Ohio weather.

Let the battery charge up good pull off the air cleaner give it shot of wd40 see if it starts and take a good look at the air filters

 

[antfarmer2]

Let the battery charge up good pull off the air cleaner give it shot of wd40 see if it starts and take a good look at the air filters

Did you close the bleeder valve after bleeding? And make sure you aux hydro is not stuck on

 

[david.ervin]

Did you close the bleeder valve after bleeding? And make sure you aux hydro is not stuck on

Yeah, valve closed, aux hydro off. The air filters are both new (less than 20 hours). I'll bring the battery inside and let it warm up before I give it another shot.

 

[antfarmer2]

Yeah, valve closed, aux hydro off. The air filters are both new (less than 20 hours). I'll bring the battery inside and let it warm up before I give it another shot.

Keep it on the charger and check the water in it

 

[antfarmer2]

Keep it on the charger and check the water in it

While the battery is charging pull a glow plug and test it on the battery it should glow about a 1/4 inch all the way to the tip

 

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While the battery is charging pull a glow plug and test it on the battery it should glow about a 1/4 inch all the way to the tip

fuel tank pickup tube?

 

[jkwilson]

Have you physically looked at the fuel shut-off to make sure it is opening? Spent about 10 minutes cussing a trencher once only to find a screw had come loose on the shutoff and when I pushed it the whole thing slid down instead of pushing the cable. Any smoke when you crank?

 

[david.ervin]

Have you physically looked at the fuel shut-off to make sure it is opening? Spent about 10 minutes cussing a trencher once only to find a screw had come loose on the shutoff and when I pushed it the whole thing slid down instead of pushing the cable. Any smoke when you crank?

Ok, got to tinker with it some more this weekend. I bled out the fuel injector pump, and got a couple small bubble there. There's plenty of diesel coming through, so everything seems reasonable from a supply perspective. Charged the battery, cranked it up, and after a little while, got it to fire. I ran the skid loader around for about an hour cleaning up gravel and firewood, parked it back in the garage, shut it down. Tried to start it back up about 20 minutes later, just to check my work, and once again it won't start. It cranks fast, glow plugs glow, I've pretty well ruled out fuel supply. Any last ditch ideas?

 

[Tigerhaze]

Ok, got to tinker with it some more this weekend. I bled out the fuel injector pump, and got a couple small bubble there. There's plenty of diesel coming through, so everything seems reasonable from a supply perspective. Charged the battery, cranked it up, and after a little while, got it to fire. I ran the skid loader around for about an hour cleaning up gravel and firewood, parked it back in the garage, shut it down. Tried to start it back up about 20 minutes later, just to check my work, and once again it won't start. It cranks fast, glow plugs glow, I've pretty well ruled out fuel supply. Any last ditch ideas?

How many hours are on this engine? Have you checked compression? The most basic factors for getting a diesel to start are fuel, compression, and timing. You know you have fuel and timing since it runs good once it starts, but compression may be an issue since you know it is getting good and warm and the glow plugs work. Most worn out diesels will run good once they start, but are a bear to start initially because compression is so low.

 

[Tazza]

How many hours are on this engine? Have you checked compression? The most basic factors for getting a diesel to start are fuel, compression, and timing. You know you have fuel and timing since it runs good once it starts, but compression may be an issue since you know it is getting good and warm and the glow plugs work. Most worn out diesels will run good once they start, but are a bear to start initially because compression is so low.

When cranking, is it puffing white smoke?
Only 20 minutes off after an hour, it should have been hot enough to fire up.
I'd install a hand primer in the fule line. Get a helper to crank while i was there squeezing the primer bulb to give it more fuel pressure.
The bubbles you mentioned, that may be a leak pulling air in, this will cause you all sorts of trouble. Air pockets on a diesel prevent it running.

 

[david.ervin]

When cranking, is it puffing white smoke?
Only 20 minutes off after an hour, it should have been hot enough to fire up.
I'd install a hand primer in the fule line. Get a helper to crank while i was there squeezing the primer bulb to give it more fuel pressure.
The bubbles you mentioned, that may be a leak pulling air in, this will cause you all sorts of trouble. Air pockets on a diesel prevent it running.

Got my helper out there, and it definitely puffs white smoke when it's cranking. That's vaporized diesel, yes? There is a primer bulb on the fuel line before the filer / water separator, which was pretty helpful getting the air out of the system earlier.

 

[antfarmer2]

Got my helper out there, and it definitely puffs white smoke when it's cranking. That's vaporized diesel, yes? There is a primer bulb on the fuel line before the filer / water separator, which was pretty helpful getting the air out of the system earlier.

Will it fire with wd? And then die? If so you are sucking air check all fuel lines even the little ones between can suck air

 

[Tazza]

Will it fire with wd? And then die? If so you are sucking air check all fuel lines even the little ones between can suck air

White smoke means you are getting fuel, but it's not quite hot enough to make it burn.
You think the plugs are ok, i'd still pull them and ensure they are hot rite to the tip, they are fairly easy to access.

 

[david.ervin]

White smoke means you are getting fuel, but it's not quite hot enough to make it burn.
You think the plugs are ok, i'd still pull them and ensure they are hot rite to the tip, they are fairly easy to access.

Since I was well and truly stumped here, I called in the service guys. They figured out that the solenoid which controls fuel into the injector pump had burnt up and was no longer retracting. THAT turned out to be caused by a bad timer that controls when the two coils in the solenoid activate and deactivate. Replaced both, and the Bobcat starts like a champ. I guess it was getting fuel, just not nearly enough to run itself on. Thanks for sticking with me on this troubleshooting!