T200 muffler/injectors

[AKstace]

Hi guys, I'm new to this forum but it looks like it's full of great info! I picked up a very used T200 last year (about 3,800 hours) and have had some engine trouble. It has the Deutz BF4M 1011F in it. Anyway, it's been bogging down when I try to push into a fairly small pile of gravel to fill the bucket even at full throttle when I try to go in at full speed. If I back off my sticks to about half speed I can sort of power through it but it doesn't seem right. The engine seems to be running great but someone suggested testing the injectors so I pulled them last week. I took them to a diesel shop and had them tested and they're just fine so I was barking up the wrong tree. I put them back in with a little difficulty mostly because the muffler is in the way so I took that completely off. After a few problems I finally got the air bled from the fuel system and it starts right up and seems to be running fine but it's pretty noisy and I'm wondering if it's that gasket for the muffler. I have kind of a loud ticking noise — that wouldn't have anything to do with the injectors, would it? I live about an hour from the dealer and they were closed when I put the machine back together and I didn't have a new gasket so I tried some hi-temp black RTV thinking that might work. Anyone got some advice for this newbie? I'm certainly no mechanic but I'm trying to do what I can. Thanks!!!

 

[Tazza]

RTV will be fine.
You describe a lack of power, could it be as simple as the drive belt slipping?
When you load it down, does the engine bog down or just the machine slows? Is there any smoke from the exhaust? If the engine still runs well but doesn't load down when you are pushing into a pile of dirt, the drive belt probably needs adjusting.

 

[AKstace]

RTV will be fine.
You describe a lack of power, could it be as simple as the drive belt slipping?
When you load it down, does the engine bog down or just the machine slows? Is there any smoke from the exhaust? If the engine still runs well but doesn't load down when you are pushing into a pile of dirt, the drive belt probably needs adjusting.

Thanks for your reply
I thought RTV would work too so maybe something else is causing the noise... that worries me. Could pulling the injectors and putting them back mess something up that would cause the noise I'm describing?
The engine bogs down and will die unless I stop and let it come back up. No smoke. And I'm not lifting or tilting when I try to do this. I'll check into the drive belt.

 

[AKstace]

Thanks for your reply
I thought RTV would work too so maybe something else is causing the noise... that worries me. Could pulling the injectors and putting them back mess something up that would cause the noise I'm describing?
The engine bogs down and will die unless I stop and let it come back up. No smoke. And I'm not lifting or tilting when I try to do this. I'll check into the drive belt.

I just reread your post. It wouldn't be the drive belt then.

 

[Tazza]

I just reread your post. It wouldn't be the drive belt then.

Well i'm not sure.... A turbo issue would decrease the power too, but i would suspect it would smoke a lot too.
Hopefully another member has other ideas.... I have never worked on one of these engines.

 

[lesgawlik]

Well i'm not sure.... A turbo issue would decrease the power too, but i would suspect it would smoke a lot too.
Hopefully another member has other ideas.... I have never worked on one of these engines.

Does it start right up? Has the timing belt been looked at? A bad timing belt can make the engine appear weak. I have a T200 which was formerly a rental. I think it was reasonably well maintained, but from the welds on the arms, it had a hard, hard life. I had a great shop look at it before I committed to buy, and the engine was a bit weak. The shop thought it was injectors, but they tested fine. After a timing belt, it ran great.

 

[AKstace]

Does it start right up? Has the timing belt been looked at? A bad timing belt can make the engine appear weak. I have a T200 which was formerly a rental. I think it was reasonably well maintained, but from the welds on the arms, it had a hard, hard life. I had a great shop look at it before I committed to buy, and the engine was a bit weak. The shop thought it was injectors, but they tested fine. After a timing belt, it ran great.

Yes, starts right up. I had a little difficulty before I got all of the air bled out of the fuel lines but now it cranks right up. I have the paperwork saying that the belt was replaced about 2 years ago but I don't know how many hours ago that was. I bought it about one year ago and have only put around 150 hours on it. Will have the dealer check the timing belt next tim it's in.
It ran great and sounded great aside from bogging down before I pulled the injectors (and muffler) to have them tested. Now it sounds rough so I'm trying to figure out if it's the muffler or something having to do with the injectors.

 

[AKstace]

Yes, starts right up. I had a little difficulty before I got all of the air bled out of the fuel lines but now it cranks right up. I have the paperwork saying that the belt was replaced about 2 years ago but I don't know how many hours ago that was. I bought it about one year ago and have only put around 150 hours on it. Will have the dealer check the timing belt next tim it's in.
It ran great and sounded great aside from bogging down before I pulled the injectors (and muffler) to have them tested. Now it sounds rough so I'm trying to figure out if it's the muffler or something having to do with the injectors.

Just figured out where the noise is coming from: I have exhaust leaking around the injectors. Not sure why that would be happening.

 

[gtstang462002]

Just figured out where the noise is coming from: I have exhaust leaking around the injectors. Not sure why that would be happening.

It sounds like you don't have them in there tight enough or you are missing the copper washer that sits between the injector nozzle and cylinder head. Definitely fix that before running it too long, it can damage the injector and/or the cylinder head otherwise.

 

[AKstace]

It sounds like you don't have them in there tight enough or you are missing the copper washer that sits between the injector nozzle and cylinder head. Definitely fix that before running it too long, it can damage the injector and/or the cylinder head otherwise.

Thanks, gtstang. Yeah, figured it out right before I went to bed last night. It can only be the copper washers. I've only run it for about 5 minutes so far so should be okay. Will pick up some more washers today as well as some flare wrenches!
Any ideas about the bogging down issue? Could it be my fuel pumps with the engine running okay and not smoking or anything? Could one of them be causing the lack of power? Should I start a separate thread on that topic?
Thanks guys!

 

[AKstace]

Thanks, gtstang. Yeah, figured it out right before I went to bed last night. It can only be the copper washers. I've only run it for about 5 minutes so far so should be okay. Will pick up some more washers today as well as some flare wrenches!
Any ideas about the bogging down issue? Could it be my fuel pumps with the engine running okay and not smoking or anything? Could one of them be causing the lack of power? Should I start a separate thread on that topic?
Thanks guys!

Well, drove to my Bobcat dealer today (an hour away) and picked up some copper washers for the injectors and a new exhaust gasket. Pulled the injectors (and muffler) and cleaned everything up and put the new washers on and just got it all put back together and it is running perfectly. Even seems to have a big more zip to it than before so maybe the power issue that I mentioned is better. I'm not going to tear into the fuel pumps just yet. Happy to have a machine running again!
Also found out from my service guy that the black RTV wouldn't have held up between the exhaust manifold and muffler. He said it just gets too hot so it's a good thing I pulled it apart again.
Another trick that he told me was to put a dowel rod the same size of the injector nozzle into the hole after pulling the injector out and to blow some air around there to get any loose particles out so that you make sure the copper washers seal correctly. Seems to work well.
Hope all of this helps the next guy. Really appreciate the info posted on this forum.