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864wood

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Mar 27, 2004
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87
I don't have time tonight to get into this great topic but I will elaborate later. Yumm!
 

864wood

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Joined
Mar 27, 2004
Messages
87
Good idea! I love storytime... I'll be back when 864 begins to talk.
Yes its true, it is possible to get a track machine stuck. I accomplished this dubious feat on a backfill job. The dirt that I originally did the backfill was pure clay and I did this work in the winter so much of the material rolled into the holes was frozen and saturated with water. On a susequent trip to the foundation I had capped this muck with about 10" of decent bank run and sand. By the third trip for final grade we had been getting rain every other day which did not allow the ground to ever really dry up. At the rear of the lot was one little pile of clay left over from initial backfill and the contractor wanted to loose it during the course of the work. So having so much luck with the floatation of a rubber track machine I did not fully appreciate how saturated the ground was. I drove to the clay pile, opened the combo to take a bite of the pile, carved off a piece to drag clay to a more firm piece of ground, managed to back up @10' which put me on backfilled clay with the dirt cap. It was here that the problems started................. The clay/mud finnaly pumped through the cap and gushed to the surface. The right front track sunk @ 20" nose low. Having been mired before I did the age old trick of trying to use the bucket to push myself out backwards. However by raising the bucket ever so slightly to right front track sank another 10". So after a slight adrenline burst I gently pushed the bucket back down to original position to have the right rear of the track to sink @ 20". Mind you I never motored the track forward or aft knowing it would sink machine further. So I proceeded to dig the whole side of the machine out by hand. It scavenged recycled concrete and boards from the job had the machine to the point where it looked like it would drive out. This took about 2 hrs! I climbed back in went to move just a tiny bit and the damn machine plunged another 12" right nose low. I would say I had it mired right nose low at @45% angle. Pretty pathetic overall. So I called Team Fountain and he brought his 580XL 4x4 Case backhoe out to job to drag me out and the hydraulic/static pressure on the machine was so great it almost didn't come out. I only wish I had a camera for pictures and so did Team Fountain. I could win photo contests with the results and Team Fountain could have had great blackmail material.
 

Tigerotor77W

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Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Messages
268
Yes its true, it is possible to get a track machine stuck. I accomplished this dubious feat on a backfill job. The dirt that I originally did the backfill was pure clay and I did this work in the winter so much of the material rolled into the holes was frozen and saturated with water. On a susequent trip to the foundation I had capped this muck with about 10" of decent bank run and sand. By the third trip for final grade we had been getting rain every other day which did not allow the ground to ever really dry up. At the rear of the lot was one little pile of clay left over from initial backfill and the contractor wanted to loose it during the course of the work. So having so much luck with the floatation of a rubber track machine I did not fully appreciate how saturated the ground was. I drove to the clay pile, opened the combo to take a bite of the pile, carved off a piece to drag clay to a more firm piece of ground, managed to back up @10' which put me on backfilled clay with the dirt cap. It was here that the problems started................. The clay/mud finnaly pumped through the cap and gushed to the surface. The right front track sunk @ 20" nose low. Having been mired before I did the age old trick of trying to use the bucket to push myself out backwards. However by raising the bucket ever so slightly to right front track sank another 10". So after a slight adrenline burst I gently pushed the bucket back down to original position to have the right rear of the track to sink @ 20". Mind you I never motored the track forward or aft knowing it would sink machine further. So I proceeded to dig the whole side of the machine out by hand. It scavenged recycled concrete and boards from the job had the machine to the point where it looked like it would drive out. This took about 2 hrs! I climbed back in went to move just a tiny bit and the damn machine plunged another 12" right nose low. I would say I had it mired right nose low at @45% angle. Pretty pathetic overall. So I called Team Fountain and he brought his 580XL 4x4 Case backhoe out to job to drag me out and the hydraulic/static pressure on the machine was so great it almost didn't come out. I only wish I had a camera for pictures and so did Team Fountain. I could win photo contests with the results and Team Fountain could have had great blackmail material.
Aww... poor kitty! (I mean the Bobcat.) It churns my heart to see great machines get stuck. I don't know why. If it's like a school bus getting stuck in snow, that's great, but watching a Bobcat or Cat get stuck in mud is gut-wrenching. ANYhow -- not surprised that the machine got stuck given those conditions. Proves that nothing is invincible, I guess. But imagine where you would have been if you had a wheeled machine... *shudders* Team Fountain uses a Case LB and a Bobcat SSL? Odd. (To me, at least) Xing
 

Team Fountain

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Joined
Mar 16, 2004
Messages
61
Aww... poor kitty! (I mean the Bobcat.) It churns my heart to see great machines get stuck. I don't know why. If it's like a school bus getting stuck in snow, that's great, but watching a Bobcat or Cat get stuck in mud is gut-wrenching. ANYhow -- not surprised that the machine got stuck given those conditions. Proves that nothing is invincible, I guess. But imagine where you would have been if you had a wheeled machine... *shudders* Team Fountain uses a Case LB and a Bobcat SSL? Odd. (To me, at least) Xing
Had 864wood ( code name “Master of Disaster”) done that job with a wheeled machine, he would have been down to the basement footings. Don't let him fool you, he's been stuck more than once. He's just being shy.
S250,
I had my 580SL long before I had a Bobcat. I couldn't live without it. In my mind, I just can't see buying a mini excavator and having to jump back and forth between equipment to get the job done. With the 580, you can do some damage quickly and then get the jobsite back in order just as fast. It's also good to keep it around, living so close to 864wood and all. The Bobcat came along later for blowing snow. Then I started using it for grading, auger, trencher, etc. Soon, 864wood had me talked into the T300. Now I can't live without it, either.
Hi, my name is Team Fountain and I'm an equipment, truck, and tool slut. Step 1 complete.
emotion-8.gif
 

Tigerotor77W

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Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Messages
268
Had 864wood ( code name “Master of Disaster”) done that job with a wheeled machine, he would have been down to the basement footings. Don't let him fool you, he's been stuck more than once. He's just being shy.
S250,
I had my 580SL long before I had a Bobcat. I couldn't live without it. In my mind, I just can't see buying a mini excavator and having to jump back and forth between equipment to get the job done. With the 580, you can do some damage quickly and then get the jobsite back in order just as fast. It's also good to keep it around, living so close to 864wood and all. The Bobcat came along later for blowing snow. Then I started using it for grading, auger, trencher, etc. Soon, 864wood had me talked into the T300. Now I can't live without it, either.
Hi, my name is Team Fountain and I'm an equipment, truck, and tool slut. Step 1 complete.
Team Fountain and 864-- He's (you've) been stuck more than once? In a track machine? Bad news...
 

Team Fountain

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Joined
Mar 16, 2004
Messages
61
Team Fountain and 864-- He's (you've) been stuck more than once? In a track machine? Bad news...
S250,
It's not bad news, it's just that 864's purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others.......
emotion-2.gif

Really, I have a great deal of respect for 864 and the way he uses his equipment. He jumps into a project with both feet. He's able to finish a job while others are still standing there wondering if they should even try it. Sometimes it bites him in the arse, most times he just comes out muddy. I think he and I both live by the theory “The only way to find out what you are capable of, is to find out what you are capable of.” Sounds silly, sometimes it even gets you in trouble, but in general it seems to be a good way to live....
 

Tigerotor77W

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Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Messages
268
S250,
It's not bad news, it's just that 864's purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others.......
Really, I have a great deal of respect for 864 and the way he uses his equipment. He jumps into a project with both feet. He's able to finish a job while others are still standing there wondering if they should even try it. Sometimes it bites him in the arse, most times he just comes out muddy. I think he and I both live by the theory “The only way to find out what you are capable of, is to find out what you are capable of.” Sounds silly, sometimes it even gets you in trouble, but in general it seems to be a good way to live....
Oh, absolutely -- I was more of... I dunno, sarcastic about the whole thing. Having a machine get stuck is scary (and also breathtaking) for me. *reads his previous comment about stuck machines* And heartwrenching. :) In all seriousness -- I definitely respect the guy who wades in. Depends on the situation, but I like trying new things out as well, and can understand your point. I'm blabbing on quite a bit. Ya see what happens when I get excited over a stuck machine? hehe
 

Team Fountain

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Joined
Mar 16, 2004
Messages
61
Oh, absolutely -- I was more of... I dunno, sarcastic about the whole thing. Having a machine get stuck is scary (and also breathtaking) for me. *reads his previous comment about stuck machines* And heartwrenching. :) In all seriousness -- I definitely respect the guy who wades in. Depends on the situation, but I like trying new things out as well, and can understand your point. I'm blabbing on quite a bit. Ya see what happens when I get excited over a stuck machine? hehe
I just remembered an incident from when I was about 10. I always worked for my father's construction company in the summers. Well, this particular year one of the projects was a garage for a classic car collector. To say the jobsite was crowded is an understatement. Anyway, we had to put in a block retaining wall on the side of a hill to pour the driveway to. We hired a local equipment rental to dig footings for the wall (about 150' long). Well, he was using a loader / backhoe, driving on the side of the hill, and using the outriggers to level the machine. About 1/3 of the way into the dig, he went to raise the outrigger and move. As he raised the outrigger, instead of it raising, the machine started to roll. He quickly put the outrigger back down so he could assess the situation. By then, the neighbor was outside. Our wall was going 3' off the property line. Needless to say, the neighbor was already pissed about the wall and figured a great way to get even was to assure us that if we got so much as a pebble over the property line, she would sue. That eliminated the option of spinning the machine and driving down the hill. The final solution stunned me. The operator finally let about half the air out of the uphill rear tire. After that, he was able to finish the dig and drive off the hill without flipping. As we were adding air back to the tire after the dig, he confessed he never thought that would work. I learned some stuff that day.........
 

864wood

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Joined
Mar 27, 2004
Messages
87
I just remembered an incident from when I was about 10. I always worked for my father's construction company in the summers. Well, this particular year one of the projects was a garage for a classic car collector. To say the jobsite was crowded is an understatement. Anyway, we had to put in a block retaining wall on the side of a hill to pour the driveway to. We hired a local equipment rental to dig footings for the wall (about 150' long). Well, he was using a loader / backhoe, driving on the side of the hill, and using the outriggers to level the machine. About 1/3 of the way into the dig, he went to raise the outrigger and move. As he raised the outrigger, instead of it raising, the machine started to roll. He quickly put the outrigger back down so he could assess the situation. By then, the neighbor was outside. Our wall was going 3' off the property line. Needless to say, the neighbor was already pissed about the wall and figured a great way to get even was to assure us that if we got so much as a pebble over the property line, she would sue. That eliminated the option of spinning the machine and driving down the hill. The final solution stunned me. The operator finally let about half the air out of the uphill rear tire. After that, he was able to finish the dig and drive off the hill without flipping. As we were adding air back to the tire after the dig, he confessed he never thought that would work. I learned some stuff that day.........
In fairness to the original stauck story, that was in fact the second stuck episode. The first was the day aftter hurricane Isabel on the eastern seaboard and I was mucking out swales and the general jobsite. I was on @15% slope left track low and I took a monster bite of pure slop. Figuring a pint of water is a pound and an 84" bucket holds @28.3cu' of material, go figure how much water weight was added to my load. The result was it forced the machine to slide left skid low and backwards into a pond. Wahhhhh! I had 3 different contracting crews betting I would not get it out. It took aboud 70 min, alot of sweat and a generally bad attitude for being a dumdass and I was back in business. All of which was still billable time.
 

Tigerotor77W

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Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Messages
268
In fairness to the original stauck story, that was in fact the second stuck episode. The first was the day aftter hurricane Isabel on the eastern seaboard and I was mucking out swales and the general jobsite. I was on @15% slope left track low and I took a monster bite of pure slop. Figuring a pint of water is a pound and an 84" bucket holds @28.3cu' of material, go figure how much water weight was added to my load. The result was it forced the machine to slide left skid low and backwards into a pond. Wahhhhh! I had 3 different contracting crews betting I would not get it out. It took aboud 70 min, alot of sweat and a generally bad attitude for being a dumdass and I was back in business. All of which was still billable time.
Pond? wow.
 

864wood

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Joined
Mar 27, 2004
Messages
87
Question -- how close to stalling your engines do you go? For you track-machines people, is it possible to stall while pushing a pile? Or only while turning? Or how?
I find that most things with bobcats seem stupid or immpossible I can achieve with ease. Not a glowing comment but factually accurate. I can stall my 864G when trying to push impossibly heavy loads and using the lift function at the same time. For example I did the demo in a block foundation and slab. It turns out the slab varied from 8'' to 24" in thickness. I had to use my Stihl 16" diamond concrete saw to do relief cuts and then worry the concret to the point of braking up. The task was then to haul these impoosible pieces out of the hole then load onto dumpster. I found I could stall it alot on this project. The builder that I was doing the work for had figured 4-8 hrs for block and foundation demo and 2-3 concrete dumpsters. It took me 16hrs, ten dumpsters(mostly overloaded), one broken backhoe cyclinder push rod, one extremly abused combo bucket with broken teeth and bucket has deformed sides. That is not the worst. I think I put the equvalent of 100hrs of abuse on my new tracks. Lets just say I wouldn't admit defeat and allow the bulider to get a different contractor to finish the job. Next time I will do a test drill for slab thickness with my hammerdrill to see if I take on the job. Hard lesson learned.
 

500K_773

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Joined
Mar 5, 2004
Messages
342
I find that most things with bobcats seem stupid or immpossible I can achieve with ease. Not a glowing comment but factually accurate. I can stall my 864G when trying to push impossibly heavy loads and using the lift function at the same time. For example I did the demo in a block foundation and slab. It turns out the slab varied from 8'' to 24" in thickness. I had to use my Stihl 16" diamond concrete saw to do relief cuts and then worry the concret to the point of braking up. The task was then to haul these impoosible pieces out of the hole then load onto dumpster. I found I could stall it alot on this project. The builder that I was doing the work for had figured 4-8 hrs for block and foundation demo and 2-3 concrete dumpsters. It took me 16hrs, ten dumpsters(mostly overloaded), one broken backhoe cyclinder push rod, one extremly abused combo bucket with broken teeth and bucket has deformed sides. That is not the worst. I think I put the equvalent of 100hrs of abuse on my new tracks. Lets just say I wouldn't admit defeat and allow the bulider to get a different contractor to finish the job. Next time I will do a test drill for slab thickness with my hammerdrill to see if I take on the job. Hard lesson learned.
I hope you bid the job accordingly. Although, it sounds like it may have cost you more in damage to your equipment than you were able to charge. It is amazing how hard concrete can get and the reinforcement steel makes demolishion than much more difficult / time consuming. I almost bought the hydraulic breaker for my machine, but thought about how much abuse my machine would see operating it and decided against it. I think an excavator with a thumb and hyraulic breaker, if necessary, is the second best method for demolishion, dynamite or C4 is probably the first
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. The excavator is a lot less abusive on the operator and no wear on the tires / tracks either.
 

Tigerotor77W

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Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Messages
268
I hope you bid the job accordingly. Although, it sounds like it may have cost you more in damage to your equipment than you were able to charge. It is amazing how hard concrete can get and the reinforcement steel makes demolishion than much more difficult / time consuming. I almost bought the hydraulic breaker for my machine, but thought about how much abuse my machine would see operating it and decided against it. I think an excavator with a thumb and hyraulic breaker, if necessary, is the second best method for demolishion, dynamite or C4 is probably the first . The excavator is a lot less abusive on the operator and no wear on the tires / tracks either.
And I just heard that it is possible to stall a Cat... heh heh heh. Sorry, I had to bring that up...
 

Bob Horrell

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Joined
Feb 22, 2005
Messages
15
And I just heard that it is possible to stall a Cat... heh heh heh. Sorry, I had to bring that up...
Recent rains in California have caused quite a few equipment disasters. There is a road near where I live that is just above a lake and leads to 4 homesites. I usually grade this road in the spring time to remove the winter rain damage. This area got over 20 inches of rain in a recent storm and I got a call from the homeowners to fix the road which was impassable. I told them I knew it was too wet to fix and to call me when they could dig a hole 18 inches deep without any water filling into it. There is about 6 to 10 feet of silt on top of a clay base in this location and the water has to evaporate out since the clay keeps it from perculating down. The surface can sometimes seem dry on the surface but it is still wet underneath and equipment will sink. They didn't want to wait and called a backhoe guy who came out and promptly stuck his backhoe up to the top of the rear tires. Boom, stabilizers, and bucket were all worthless in getting unstuck so he called a buddy with a dozer. The dozer got stuck up to the top of the tracks. They then rented a 85,000lb excavator and took 2 days to get everything out. There was also a 4X4 pickup stuck up to the middle of the doors when the backhoe first arrived. I cleaned up the road about 12 days later. It took that long for it to get dry enough. There was a house nearby with mud up the the bottom of windows in the back of the house. The lady asked me if I could clean it out. When I started to walk toward the house, I could make the ground shake like a bowl of jello and I was still about 100+ feet away from the house. Nothing I could do then, and I felt sorry for the lady as water was seeping through the walls and ruining her house.
 
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