Found out more about my hyd. problem

Help Support SkidSteer Forum:

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
Went to the local BC distributor for a few more parts and they let me in the shop to talk to the 853 expert. I explained the arms and bucket would only move the little green light under the gauges, on the upper right hand side was blinking. He said my aux. hyd. were stuck?? and it was probably dirt in the system. I removed the two aux. hyd. solenoid's and spools from the main control body, cleaned, found no dirt, reinstalled and does the same thing..$#(@*$. Anybody got any suggestions......Could it be the solenoid's, how would I check them?. He said to connect the aux. hyd. together, in a loop, and if everything worked, that was definitely the problem...Of course I don't have a hose and connectors to check this.
 

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
One more thing......next to the blinking green light is a push button use to turn on and off the aux. hyd., the light stays on when I push the button..................bummer...
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
One more thing......next to the blinking green light is a push button use to turn on and off the aux. hyd., the light stays on when I push the button..................bummer...
Perry
the two little green lights should wouk like this
You start the engine both lights are off, you push button once and one green light comes on.
This mode is for using a hydraulic cylinder on your aux front couplers the oil only flows intermittantly, and is controled by the “self centering” thumb switch on the rh steering lever. ie push the switch to the R with you thumb and your grapple attachment closes. Push the same switch to the left and your grapple attachment opens.
The second mode. Push the button by the green light a second time, now both green lights should be on. Instead of using the thumb switch you now use the finger “trigger“ switch on the front side of the RH steering lever. Squeezing the trigger switch will cause the oil to flow contiuously until you squeeze the trigger a second time. This mode is used for a hoe attachment or brushcutter, something requireing continuos flow to opperate.
Your loader appears to be stuck in the continuos mode as you always haveing this trouble
When you start the engine the green lights should both be off.
If they were on (aux hyd was in use) b4 you shut the machine off (and they would be on only if you pushed the button beside them, and you would only push this button because you wanted to use the “auxilary hydraulics” / “front quick couplers”) they should automatically go out every time the key is turned off.
If they (one or both) are on when you start the engine and you never touched th button beside them then there is (likely) a problem with the switch or wiring.
If thats the case, then the problem may not be dirt at all.
with the key on, are one or both green lights on?
If yes then go to the main hyd valve (the one the foot pedal linkages connect to) there will be a section for one foot pedal, a section for the other and a 3rd section for the aux hyd. This 3rd section will have a spool (round black thing, smaller then your fist) with 2 wires coming from it. One spool on each end.
Gently remove the nut in the center and try to slide the coil (black thing) off the spool (metal rod in center that nut was attached to) the green lights indicate that one or of the spools is getting power so there should be a magnetic pull holding the coil on the spool, you slide it partially off and magnetic pull trys to put it back on.
If your problem is electrical you can unplug the wires to each spool then the flow to the aux couplers should stop.
If the problem is still there then it may be dirt (though im not sure why either green light should be on)
If disconecting the spools does not work then remove your front aux couplers and get a hyd shop to make you a hyd hose to fit the end of the steel lines,
or follow the steel lines up to the top/rear of the loader arm and disconect the 2 hoses there and buy a fitting to join them together. They should be a # 10 JIC male one each hose. So you would need a double # 10 female to join them. these are common hyd fittings that most hyd hose shops should have
or buy a male and female couplers and a hyd hose to fit between them and plg them into the couplers to “loop” the aux hyd together (more $ but easy to insall or remove)
after looping you aux hyd valve spool you should have eliminated this as a potential problem
Ken
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
Perry
the two little green lights should wouk like this
You start the engine both lights are off, you push button once and one green light comes on.
This mode is for using a hydraulic cylinder on your aux front couplers the oil only flows intermittantly, and is controled by the “self centering” thumb switch on the rh steering lever. ie push the switch to the R with you thumb and your grapple attachment closes. Push the same switch to the left and your grapple attachment opens.
The second mode. Push the button by the green light a second time, now both green lights should be on. Instead of using the thumb switch you now use the finger “trigger“ switch on the front side of the RH steering lever. Squeezing the trigger switch will cause the oil to flow contiuously until you squeeze the trigger a second time. This mode is used for a hoe attachment or brushcutter, something requireing continuos flow to opperate.
Your loader appears to be stuck in the continuos mode as you always haveing this trouble
When you start the engine the green lights should both be off.
If they were on (aux hyd was in use) b4 you shut the machine off (and they would be on only if you pushed the button beside them, and you would only push this button because you wanted to use the “auxilary hydraulics” / “front quick couplers”) they should automatically go out every time the key is turned off.
If they (one or both) are on when you start the engine and you never touched th button beside them then there is (likely) a problem with the switch or wiring.
If thats the case, then the problem may not be dirt at all.
with the key on, are one or both green lights on?
If yes then go to the main hyd valve (the one the foot pedal linkages connect to) there will be a section for one foot pedal, a section for the other and a 3rd section for the aux hyd. This 3rd section will have a spool (round black thing, smaller then your fist) with 2 wires coming from it. One spool on each end.
Gently remove the nut in the center and try to slide the coil (black thing) off the spool (metal rod in center that nut was attached to) the green lights indicate that one or of the spools is getting power so there should be a magnetic pull holding the coil on the spool, you slide it partially off and magnetic pull trys to put it back on.
If your problem is electrical you can unplug the wires to each spool then the flow to the aux couplers should stop.
If the problem is still there then it may be dirt (though im not sure why either green light should be on)
If disconecting the spools does not work then remove your front aux couplers and get a hyd shop to make you a hyd hose to fit the end of the steel lines,
or follow the steel lines up to the top/rear of the loader arm and disconect the 2 hoses there and buy a fitting to join them together. They should be a # 10 JIC male one each hose. So you would need a double # 10 female to join them. these are common hyd fittings that most hyd hose shops should have
or buy a male and female couplers and a hyd hose to fit between them and plg them into the couplers to “loop” the aux hyd together (more $ but easy to insall or remove)
after looping you aux hyd valve spool you should have eliminated this as a potential problem
Ken
Perry
the green lights whould normally be on solid, I'm not sure what the blicking indicates but its likely a malfunction indication, I'll try to check my manual for you.
Also a hose or fitting to loop the aux hyd should no be more then $30 or so. I know how you feel but if unplugging the coils does not work then that is likely the next be test. Try to get a hose made you can use somewhere else.
Sorry, by the time I got done trying to explain all this I forgot part of what you said.
regards
Ken
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
Perry
the green lights whould normally be on solid, I'm not sure what the blicking indicates but its likely a malfunction indication, I'll try to check my manual for you.
Also a hose or fitting to loop the aux hyd should no be more then $30 or so. I know how you feel but if unplugging the coils does not work then that is likely the next be test. Try to get a hose made you can use somewhere else.
Sorry, by the time I got done trying to explain all this I forgot part of what you said.
regards
Ken
Perry
Sorry I lied to you the fittingd I said were #10 are #12 JIC, the female nut on the line tales a 1 1/4” wrench.
I have some pics of new “flat” Faster brand and the earlier Pioneer brand I'll post later tonight.
Ken
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
Perry
Sorry I lied to you the fittingd I said were #10 are #12 JIC, the female nut on the line tales a 1 1/4” wrench.
I have some pics of new “flat” Faster brand and the earlier Pioneer brand I'll post later tonight.
Ken
That should read takes a 1 1/4” wrench.
and the hyd Couplers what is faster and pioneer, I need a edit tool so I can fix my %^&% ups
Ken
 

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
That should read takes a 1 1/4” wrench.
and the hyd Couplers what is faster and pioneer, I need a edit tool so I can fix my %^&% ups
Ken
Thanks fella's, first I'll pull the aux. solenoids with the ignition on and see if there is any magnetism present, thanks for the info on the handle controls, might be a wiring problem?, although I don't have any attachments but might get something later. Hoping I can get it fixed without building a loop hose. Oh Yeah! I forgot to mention the mechanic I was talking to at BC said he would come over one Saturday and help me get it going, I'm guessing he does this on the side, what ever he charges has got to be worth it. Thanks for the ongoing assistance fella's, I have followed threads that have helped me in the pass and hope others can benefit from this one.
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
Thanks fella's, first I'll pull the aux. solenoids with the ignition on and see if there is any magnetism present, thanks for the info on the handle controls, might be a wiring problem?, although I don't have any attachments but might get something later. Hoping I can get it fixed without building a loop hose. Oh Yeah! I forgot to mention the mechanic I was talking to at BC said he would come over one Saturday and help me get it going, I'm guessing he does this on the side, what ever he charges has got to be worth it. Thanks for the ongoing assistance fella's, I have followed threads that have helped me in the pass and hope others can benefit from this one.
Building a lop hose is more of a test the a fix,
And on this one if some familar can come give you a few pointers in person, I think you'll find it well worth his fee.
Let us know how you make out
Ken
 

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
Building a lop hose is more of a test the a fix,
And on this one if some familar can come give you a few pointers in person, I think you'll find it well worth his fee.
Let us know how you make out
Ken
Since the loop hose doesn't cost that much and could possibly be needed in the future I'm going ahead and have it made today.... Ken, did you find out why the aux. hyd. green lights are blinking?. Thanks
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
Since the loop hose doesn't cost that much and could possibly be needed in the future I'm going ahead and have it made today.... Ken, did you find out why the aux. hyd. green lights are blinking?. Thanks
No sorry,
I looked in the manual but seen nothing about the aux hyd mode lights blinking.
1 on, or 2 on or none on thats it.
Ken
 

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
No sorry,
I looked in the manual but seen nothing about the aux hyd mode lights blinking.
1 on, or 2 on or none on thats it.
Ken
I had the aux. hyd. loop made and the machine works like a charm, I didn't know it had a fast/slow bucket and arm operation. Ken you were right about the costs of having the loop made, $31.00. Now, when the BC mechanic comes over Saturday he can either fix it or tell me what I need to purchase to fix it.... When this is all over and it's fixed, I'll know just enough about hydraulics to be dangerous........
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
I had the aux. hyd. loop made and the machine works like a charm, I didn't know it had a fast/slow bucket and arm operation. Ken you were right about the costs of having the loop made, $31.00. Now, when the BC mechanic comes over Saturday he can either fix it or tell me what I need to purchase to fix it.... When this is all over and it's fixed, I'll know just enough about hydraulics to be dangerous........
Great, at least you know where its at now. I'd be tempted to work the machine some as is and see if everything else is in order. This is no diferent then running it with say a brushcutter running on your aux hyd. If you have no aux hyd attachments, you could just leave it like that indefinetly if you like. (not that I'd be able to leave it alone, if it was mine)
Not sure what you mean about “fast/slow bucket and arm operation” This is'nt a 853 “H” for hi flow is it?
Ken
 

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
Great, at least you know where its at now. I'd be tempted to work the machine some as is and see if everything else is in order. This is no diferent then running it with say a brushcutter running on your aux hyd. If you have no aux hyd attachments, you could just leave it like that indefinetly if you like. (not that I'd be able to leave it alone, if it was mine)
Not sure what you mean about “fast/slow bucket and arm operation” This is'nt a 853 “H” for hi flow is it?
Ken
When I push the handle all the way to operate the arms or bucket it's slow if you push about 1/4 it fast. How would I check f it's a 'H'.
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
When I push the handle all the way to operate the arms or bucket it's slow if you push about 1/4 it fast. How would I check f it's a 'H'.
Where it say 853 model on the serial # tag it would have 853h i believe.
What do you mean about the hand for the bucket or the arms. Does this have hand control not the std foot pedals to operate the loader?
Ken
 

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
Where it say 853 model on the serial # tag it would have 853h i believe.
What do you mean about the hand for the bucket or the arms. Does this have hand control not the std foot pedals to operate the loader?
Ken
Ken, Yes I have hand controls and I noticed when you push the handles all the way the bucket or arms just move slower, and when you move them about a 1/4 there fast. Below my serial number it says C-series, what ever that means?. Well the BC mechanic came over and gave the machine a once over, he said the aux. hyd. coils and spools should be replaced so, I'll order them today and hopefully that will be the fix, although he said with the loop I had made for the aux. hyd. I could go ahead and use the BC with no problems and, purchase the aux. spools and coils if I decided to run an attachment. Thanks
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
Ken, Yes I have hand controls and I noticed when you push the handles all the way the bucket or arms just move slower, and when you move them about a 1/4 there fast. Below my serial number it says C-series, what ever that means?. Well the BC mechanic came over and gave the machine a once over, he said the aux. hyd. coils and spools should be replaced so, I'll order them today and hopefully that will be the fix, although he said with the loop I had made for the aux. hyd. I could go ahead and use the BC with no problems and, purchase the aux. spools and coils if I decided to run an attachment. Thanks
Perry
It is just a std hyd flow, @ 18 gpm 853 then , the “C” is the series in which it was built, @ 1995, they went 753, 753c, 753f, 753g and now s130k are all 753, just different years. mine is a 853c as well. ours started out 843, then 853, 853c
No sure if the still made a 853 in the f series and fairly sure they had stopped by the time the g series started.
The controls should not act that way for the lift and tilt function but it may have to do with the temp loop hose.
Also be sure your main drive belt is tight, as this can make your hydraulics and hydro drives act goofy too, the belt slips under high loads, ie lifting and pushing forward at the same time
 

skidsteer.ca

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2006
Messages
3,853
Perry
It is just a std hyd flow, @ 18 gpm 853 then , the “C” is the series in which it was built, @ 1995, they went 753, 753c, 753f, 753g and now s130k are all 753, just different years. mine is a 853c as well. ours started out 843, then 853, 853c
No sure if the still made a 853 in the f series and fairly sure they had stopped by the time the g series started.
The controls should not act that way for the lift and tilt function but it may have to do with the temp loop hose.
Also be sure your main drive belt is tight, as this can make your hydraulics and hydro drives act goofy too, the belt slips under high loads, ie lifting and pushing forward at the same time
Perry
Do you know which way the oil is flowing through you quick couplers? This will tell you which of the spools is stuck.
If oil comes out the female coupler the then the rearmost spool is activated. The female coupler ) on the loader is the one that has pressure in continuos mode, and is the one that gets pressure when you push your thumb switch to the right (close the grapple) in itermittant flow mode. The male has pressure when you open the grapple. (thumb swich to the left in intermittant flow mode.
Ken
 

perry

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
869
Perry
Do you know which way the oil is flowing through you quick couplers? This will tell you which of the spools is stuck.
If oil comes out the female coupler the then the rearmost spool is activated. The female coupler ) on the loader is the one that has pressure in continuos mode, and is the one that gets pressure when you push your thumb switch to the right (close the grapple) in itermittant flow mode. The male has pressure when you open the grapple. (thumb swich to the left in intermittant flow mode.
Ken
Whoa! Ken, your way ahead of me, I dont have the operators manual, I did bid on a couple on ebay and lost. The handles have all sorts of operating functions and I don't know what they do?. the lower aux. hyd. connector on the front of the BC had the pressure, I know this because of the pressure gauge. On the front of the handles is a pull switch, what does it do?, the other swiitches have pictures indicating hyd. cylinders and such. The previous owner had his hands on this machine and didn't know what he was doing, I'm sorta in the middle of fixing his screwups, of course I'm doing this with help. Thanks
 
Top